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| kenaan | 12arigo default 1112a0a0c0eb4a 15/pypy/translator/backendopt/constfold.py: Turn off reporting const-fold errors as WARNINGs. This gives quite a bunch of warnings in any C translation, and I... | 01:23 |
|---|---|---|
| kenaan | 12arigo default 1179bcc27b894a 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/gc.py: Allow at least the front-end to be tested with the "none" gc. | 01:23 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 1136e3174f324f 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/test/test_call.py: Add another test that switch() calls are supposed to have an effectinfo of EF_RANDOM_EFFECTS. I thought it was tes... | 01:23 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 11b37ba47c5260 15/pypy/: Fix the test. | 01:23 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 11ac6210475691 15/pypy/tool/: merge heads | 01:23 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 1135781cc8c09d 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/test/test_longlong.py: Fix test. | 01:23 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 11e99702a71e7e 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/effectinfo.py: Oups. | 01:25 |
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| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1870 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/605 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-macosx-x86-64/builds/288 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-64/builds/627 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/1132 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-Ojit-no-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/812 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/731 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/1454 | 01:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-win-x86-32/builds/278 | 01:39 |
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| kenaan | 12arigo default 11c28d62b01ab1 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/effectinfo.py: Fix. | 01:55 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 115e4711c2e500 15/pypy/rlib/_stacklet_n_a.py: Add a warning message when using stacklet_destroy() with reference counting. | 01:55 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 1146119931a154 15/pypy/: Actually, it seems that the new code replaces any need for the old code. Good, I can remove the comment in rffi.py... | 01:55 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-win-x86-32/builds/278 | 01:57 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-macosx-x86-64/builds/288 | 02:04 |
| CIA-13 | 03arigo 07roundup * 10#907/Stacklets running out of memory on higher optimisation levels: | 02:07 |
| CIA-13 | [resolved] Fixed: | 02:07 |
| CIA-13 | 1) as per irc discussion, it is leaking with --opt=1 because it now (correctly) | 02:07 |
| CIA-13 | uses reference counting instead of boehm if ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue907 | 02:07 |
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| kenaan | 12ctismer win64-stage1 116110a798a844 15/pypy/translator/c/test/test_newgc.py: this patch makes at least the setup part of test_newgc work. But there is much left, which is probably bette... | 02:38 |
| kenaan | 12ctismer win64-stage1 117129b5efa170 15/pypy/rlib/rdynload.py: temp hack. something makes this cast necessary. Find the reason! | 02:38 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1870 | 02:38 |
| kenaan | 12ctismer win64-stage1 1164d02c8953ea 15/pypy/tool/: Merge | 02:38 |
| kenaan | 12ctismer win64-stage1 11422cff143e9b 15/pypy/: Merge with default | 02:38 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-win-x86-64/builds/75 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 02:40 |
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| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/1132 | 02:44 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-Ojit-no-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/812 | 02:45 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/605 | 02:45 |
| kenaan | 12ned nedbat-sandbox 11ca8246ba93b7 15/pypy/translator/sandbox/sandlib.py: An implementation of do_ll_os__ll_os_fstat, no tests, not sure if it's right. | 02:45 |
| kenaan | 12ned nedbat-sandbox 110cca0b181f5c 15/pypy/translator/sandbox/sandlib.py: Avoid a compile at startup by using our own marshalling of stat results, instead of calling into rmarshal to d... | 02:46 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-64/builds/627 | 02:46 |
| setmeaway | i havequestion, <class 'pypy.rpython.ootypesystem.rbuilder.UnicodeBuilderRepr'> has no ll_getlength but it is referenced in rpython/rbuilder.py(45), is this expected one? | 02:56 |
| verte | setmeaway: should be fine | 02:57 |
| setmeaway | but pypy doesn't satisfied with that. http://pastebin.com/aEPV2epz | 02:59 |
| setmeaway | it complained. | 02:59 |
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| Alex_Gaynor | nedbat: where are teh tests :) | 03:01 |
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| nedbat | Alex_Gaynor: fijal said commiting on a branch was more relaxed :) | 03:01 |
| Action: Alex_Gaynor is always a test-nazi | 03:02 | |
| setmeaway | can't i use ootype when translate pypy? i guess it would be fine if i specify lltype | 03:02 |
| nedbat | Alex_Gaynor: i intend to write tests. I still can't keep all the layers straight in my head. | 03:02 |
| verte | setmeaway: ootype is for .NET or JVM backends | 03:03 |
| verte | setmeaway: if you are using C backend, you want lltype | 03:03 |
| setmeaway | yes. i use jvm as backend. and as you can see in pastebin, it didn't work. | 03:04 |
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| verte | setmeaway: -Ojit and -b jvm aren't compatible | 03:05 |
| Dulak | oh 1.7 isn't leaking anymore! woot, I can turn off my bastardized harikari finally | 03:05 |
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| setmeaway | oh, i should have known that | 03:06 |
| verte | setmeaway: I don't think also there's no point specifying a --gc on jvm either | 03:06 |
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| Nick change: Gulaway -> Gulopine | 03:37 | |
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| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/731 | 03:44 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/1454 | 03:50 |
| kenaan | 12alex_gaynor default 119eec6149907c 15/pypy/module/micronumpy/interp_dtype.py: fix translation | 04:07 |
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| Garen | I'm guessing this is a known issue: MissingRTypeOperation: pow(int, int) (use float**float instead; it is too easy to overlook the overflow issues of int**int) ? | 04:52 |
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| Garen | ah, so I use float**float, then it errors out and tells me to use math.pow :) | 05:00 |
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| fijal | hi | 05:39 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-win-x86-64/builds/75 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 05:41 |
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| mattip | hi | 05:50 |
| fijal | mattip: hi | 05:50 |
| fijal | mattip: what's your full name btw? I want to mention you on the blog post | 05:51 |
| mattip | any hints on how to write a docstring for a interpreted function (like numpypy.dot)? | 05:51 |
| fijal | you just write a docstring | 05:52 |
| mattip | fijal: Matti Picus | 05:52 |
| fijal | it'll automagically propagate | 05:52 |
| fijal | I suppose you don't mind being mentioned that you worked on multidim arrays | 05:52 |
| mattip | The internet is a big scary place, but I'll get over it. | 05:53 |
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| fijal | :) | 05:53 |
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| mattip | Once again I took on something simple looking and got stuck. It seems to be endemic. | 05:54 |
| fijal | etrepum: hi | 05:54 |
| mattip | To implement multidimensinoal dot I need an iterator that runs along one dimension. | 05:55 |
| fijal | yeah, you need this for a bunch of other things as well | 05:55 |
| mattip | fijal: I guess I will add one? | 05:55 |
| fijal | so does sound like a good thing to have | 05:55 |
| etrepum | fijal: hey | 05:55 |
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| mattip | OK | 05:56 |
| fijal | etrepum: I still have decoder left to optimize btw :) | 05:56 |
| mattip | fijal: BTW, I need a branch to play on, I could not reopen matrixmath. | 05:56 |
| fijal | mattip: no, just create a new one | 05:56 |
| fijal | until you have 5 open branches, don't worry :) | 05:57 |
| etrepum | fijal: it sounded like the work you did on the encoder was pretty great, I haven't had time to take a close look at it | 05:57 |
| mattip | so would it be possible not to close the next one I open, I'm running out of good names. | 05:57 |
| fijal | etrepum: it runs faster than the C extension, so I guess yeah :) | 05:57 |
| fijal | mattip: matrixmath-dot | 05:57 |
| fijal | matrixmath-axes-iterator | 05:57 |
| etrepum | fijal: well, the C extension calls back to Python a lot for encoding | 05:57 |
| fijal | etrepum: not my fault :) | 05:58 |
| fijal | mattip: branches are one-shot | 05:58 |
| fijal | always | 05:58 |
| fijal | or single-shot | 05:58 |
| mattip | OK, got it. Thanks. Bye now. | 05:58 |
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| lahwran | dear god what in the world | 06:24 |
| fijal | lahwran: ? | 06:28 |
| lahwran | I'm attempting to detach pypy_interact.py from the rest of the pypy library so I can use it on it's own | 06:29 |
| fijal | it is the sandbox thingie right? | 06:29 |
| lahwran | I mean, besides the stuff that pypy-c needs under normal conditions | 06:29 |
| lahwran | yeah | 06:29 |
| lahwran | it imports all kinds of crap from pypy | 06:29 |
| fijal | nedbat was fighting the same thing | 06:29 |
| lahwran | yeah, he mentioned it to me earlier | 06:29 |
| fijal | yeah ok | 06:30 |
| fijal | so I know what has to be done :) | 06:30 |
| lahwran | I'm currently attempting to figure out if I can throw away s_StatResult or what | 06:30 |
| lahwran | importing it takes nearly 5 seconds and fires up gcc (wat) | 06:30 |
| fijal | yes, you can | 06:30 |
| fijal | you've seen ned's branch? | 06:30 |
| lahwran | looks like it's just used to define how to marshal a result | 06:30 |
| lahwran | no, is it public? | 06:31 |
| fijal | yes | 06:31 |
| Last message repeated 1 time(s). | 06:31 | |
| lahwran | link? | 06:31 |
| fijal | nedbat-sandbox I think | 06:31 |
| fijal | in the main repo | 06:31 |
| fijal | but he did not write tests, so you might want to start there | 06:31 |
| fijal | you can use anything else instead of s_StatResult | 06:31 |
| fijal | as long as you teach write_message how to marshal it | 06:31 |
| fijal | same for longlong | 06:31 |
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| Nick change: Gulopine -> Gulaway | 06:33 | |
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| lahwran | fijal: how do I retrieve this branch? | 06:35 |
| lahwran | and how do I see what changes he has made compared to the main branch? | 06:35 |
| lahwran | I'm used to git | 06:35 |
| fijal | you do a normal checkout | 06:36 |
| fijal | and hg up branchnamr | 06:36 |
| fijal | nedbat-sandbox is a name | 06:36 |
| fijal | but again, he did not write any tests, so I'm not sure if you're better off or not | 06:36 |
| lahwran | meh, tests are not required if the code is clean enough | 06:37 |
| lahwran | for understanding anyway | 06:37 |
| fijal | this is not what we believe in this channel :) | 06:38 |
| fijal | I can't say if the code he wrote is correct or not without tests at least | 06:38 |
| lahwran | I'm not saying tests are bad, just that it's perfectly realistic to read code that has no tests | 06:38 |
| fijal | not really in pypy | 06:38 |
| fijal | at least it does not happen often | 06:39 |
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| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: you're aware tomorrow is the deadline for talk announcement for pycon? | 06:52 |
| fijal | it should be said if it's postponed | 06:52 |
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| Nick change: unbit_ -> unbit | 06:53 | |
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| setmeaway | how can i order pypy translator preserving intermediate files? i have trouble because of it takes an hour to reach this error message NotImplementedError: cannot find the library 'gc' | 07:44 |
| setmeaway | intermediate files=result of rtyper,annotation | 07:45 |
| verte | could you please pastebin the traceback | 07:51 |
| verte | ? | 07:51 |
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| setmeaway | verte http://pastebin.com/yvMDtpzM here it is | 07:51 |
| fijal | setmeaway: what's your command line | 07:52 |
| fijal | ? | 07:52 |
| fijal | there are no intermediate files so far | 07:52 |
| fijal | you are aware that cygwin is mostly unsupported right? | 07:53 |
| fijal | if you want to fix it, I would advise you to start with tests | 07:53 |
| fijal | and not the translation | 07:53 |
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| setmeaway | (cd /tmp/pypy/pypy/translator/goal;/cygdrive/c/Python27/python.exe ./translate.py --cc i686-pc-mingw32-gcc -b c -Ojit --insist --shared --thread --gc boehm --make-jobs 4) | 07:53 |
| setmeaway | should i have to endure long runs of annotation, specialization, rtype process? | 07:54 |
| fijal | you should not use --insist | 07:54 |
| fijal | and you should not use boehm | 07:54 |
| fijal | no, make tests run | 07:54 |
| fijal | what's -b c? | 07:54 |
| setmeaway | is --backend c | 07:54 |
| fijal | that's default | 07:55 |
| fijal | you should just say -Ojit --make-jobs=4 | 07:55 |
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| fijal | but as I said, making the tests run on an unsupported platform is a good first step | 07:55 |
| setmeaway | what do you mean i make the tests? | 07:56 |
| setmeaway | is this possible to do that without long waiting? | 07:56 |
| fijal | you make them pass | 07:56 |
| fijal | yes | 07:56 |
| setmeaway | fijal oh that would be great. | 07:56 |
| fijal | tests are irrelevant to the actual translation | 07:56 |
| fijal | read about py.test | 07:57 |
| fijal | anyway | 07:57 |
| fijal | I don't understand why you passed such options, can you explain? | 07:57 |
| fijal | why not -Ojit simply? | 07:57 |
| fijal | or -Ojit --make-jobs=4 | 07:57 |
| fijal | ? | 07:57 |
| fijal | make sure translator/c/test/ passes first | 07:57 |
| setmeaway | i just read the document, and put the options as they described itself. | 07:58 |
| fijal | why did you choose boehm? | 07:58 |
| setmeaway | i built boehm for mingw32. that's all | 07:58 |
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| fijal | yeah, but why not one of our GCs? | 07:58 |
| fijal | that actually work and is supported and on by default? | 07:58 |
| fijal | anyway, make sure tests pass | 07:59 |
| setmeaway | yeah i wanted to try out, never mind. | 07:59 |
| fijal | boehm is known to be slow for example | 07:59 |
| fijal | and also is known to have slight bugs | 07:59 |
| setmeaway | fijal thanks for telling me py.test i'll try it out. | 08:00 |
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| fijal | setmeaway: this is how we develop, we first make tests pass | 08:00 |
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| djc | updated pypy in gentoo to 1.7 :) | 08:37 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1871 [12arigo] | 08:48 |
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| fijal | djc: cool | 08:49 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-win-x86-64/builds/76 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 08:50 |
| fijal | richards is what, 50x faster on pypy than on cpython??? | 08:50 |
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| verte | but you know, whos counting? | 08:51 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/1133 [12arigo] | 08:51 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-win-x86-64/builds/76 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 08:51 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/732 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 08:53 |
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| fijal | 36x on 1000 iterations | 08:54 |
| fijal | nice | 08:54 |
| lucian | very | 08:55 |
| Action: lucian claps | 08:55 | |
| fijal | also boring :) | 08:55 |
| lucian | not so much. there was an article on HN about some folks that benchmarked tornado on PyPy with ab | 08:55 |
| lucian | and it was something like twice faster | 08:55 |
| lucian | it's really awesome that there even is such a compatible alternative | 08:56 |
| lucian | this thing http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3292583 | 08:59 |
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| fijal | nice | 09:10 |
| lucian | it does seem that pypy uses more memory, though | 09:11 |
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| Action: fijal got a pypy segfault | 09:15 | |
| fijal | and a pypy memory leak | 09:15 |
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| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-macosx-x86-32/builds/729 | 09:29 |
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| bbot2 | 3Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1871 [12arigo] | 09:47 |
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| kenaan | 12fijal default 110f42372d5c50 15/pypy/module/micronumpy/: copy for slices | 09:52 |
| fijal | nice :/ | 09:52 |
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| kenaan | 12fijal default 11bef722513f6c 15/pypy/module/micronumpy/interp_numarray.py: oops, fix translation | 10:09 |
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| arigato | heh, yesterday night was the first time I've seen {mac32} finish the own tests without aborting | 10:22 |
| CIA-13 | 03masklinn 07roundup * 10#946/timeit-as-CLI does not accept import: | 10:26 |
| CIA-13 | [new] > python2.7 --version | 10:26 |
| CIA-13 | Python 2.7.2 | 10:26 |
| CIA-13 | > python2.7 -mtimeit -s 'import random' 'random.random()' | 10:26 |
| CIA-13 | 10000000 loops, best of 3: 0.116 usec per ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue946 | 10:26 |
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| CIA-13 | 03arigo 07roundup * 10#946/timeit-as-CLI does not accept import: | 10:29 |
| CIA-13 | [chatting] Works for me. Can you explain more? A priori it looks like the quoting did not | 10:29 |
| CIA-13 | work, and the last line is interpreted as: | 10:29 |
| CIA-13 | pyp ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue946 | 10:29 |
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| mattip | hi | 10:36 |
| mattip | fijal: Got a minute for a newbie question? | 10:36 |
| fijal | mattip: sure | 10:36 |
| fijal | arigato: :) | 10:36 |
| fijal | arigato: I have some-sort-of-memory-problem | 10:37 |
| mattip | How can I write a test to test_translate a function within a class? For instance, like to test the copy_for_slice before actually translating | 10:37 |
| fijal | with pypy | 10:37 |
| fijal | but I'm trying to pinpoint what's going on | 10:37 |
| fijal | it seems to behave nicely | 10:37 |
| fijal | but some sequence of invocation causes memory to explode | 10:38 |
| fijal | mattip: which test_translate? | 10:38 |
| mattip | Let me try to rephrase the quesiton. | 10:39 |
| mattip | I add a function to a class. It passes all kinds of tests. Then it crashes in traslation. Can I test for the translation failure | 10:39 |
| mattip | without actually translating the whole thing? | 10:40 |
| fijal | not really | 10:40 |
| fijal | it's a bit hard | 10:41 |
| fijal | test_zjit kinda do that | 10:41 |
| fijal | so if you add this functionality to test_compile, you can that way | 10:41 |
| mattip | But then I have to understand the syntax of test_compile ;) | 10:41 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/1133 [12arigo] | 10:42 |
| mattip | Is there a dummy's guide to test_zjit? | 10:42 |
| fijal | nope | 10:43 |
| mattip | OK. I was thinking it would not be a bad thing to try and summarize my learning experience in a blog post somewhere, I guess now I have material for another post too. | 10:44 |
| fijal | cool | 10:44 |
| mattip | Any luck with the two-loop problem? | 10:45 |
| fijal | two-loop problem? | 10:45 |
| mattip | Uhh, whatever was preventing the comparison of pypy to python, numpy, weave, ... | 10:46 |
| fijal | ah | 10:46 |
| fijal | yes, well looking into it | 10:46 |
| mattip | I did have some friends look at the math of the original benchmark. The general conclusion was that since it is a type of diffusion problem, | 10:47 |
| fijal | http://paste.pocoo.org/show/514833/ | 10:48 |
| mattip | that not using temproray results would only cause the diffusion to happen at a different rate. | 10:48 |
| fijal | can someone spot a difference? | 10:48 |
| fijal | mattip: yes, ok | 10:49 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 11925245546811 15/pypy/translator/simplify.py: Chanced upon a "x not in biglist" done in a loop: replace it with "x not in set". | 10:49 |
| fijal | mattip: but even if it's numerically correct, then it's definitely not correct in terms of performance comparison | 10:49 |
| CIA-13 | 03masklinn 07roundup * 10#946/timeit-as-CLI does not accept import: | 10:50 |
| CIA-13 | [invalid] > Are you sure pypy-c isn't a script that you wrote | 10:50 |
| CIA-13 | It's the one provided by macports, but it does indeed seem to be a very small | 10:50 |
| CIA-13 | w ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue946 | 10:50 |
| mattip | fijal: But they never claimed it converged at the same rate, only that the loop went faster. | 10:50 |
| fijal | yes right | 10:51 |
| fijal | but at least for the C++ version there is a serious difference in performance between algos | 10:51 |
| CIA-13 | 03arigo 07roundup * 10#946/timeit-as-CLI does not accept import: | 10:51 |
| CIA-13 | Macports is buggy, please report it as a bug there. It should be | 10:51 |
| CIA-13 | /opt/local/lib/pypy/pypy-c "$@" | 10:51 |
| CIA-13 | or just use a symlink instead of a script. * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue946 | 10:51 |
| CIA-13 | 03ltratt 07roundup * 10#907/Stacklets running out of memory on higher optimisation levels: | 10:52 |
| CIA-13 | [chatting] Agreed, everything now works - thanks! [Weirdly, the -OJIT version of my evil | 10:52 |
| CIA-13 | test case takes about 6 times as long to run as the -O3 ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue907 | 10:52 |
| CIA-13 | 03ltratt 07roundup * 10#907/Stacklets running out of memory on higher optimisation levels: [resolved] Mark as resolved. * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue907 | 10:52 |
| fijal | mattip: hm | 10:54 |
| mattip | fijal: as per pocoo.org/show/514833, it would seem to me that tmp0 is not what you intended. | 10:54 |
| mattip | ahhn noooo, I'm wrong again. | 10:55 |
| fijal | it should be u[i, j - 1] | 10:55 |
| fijal | from previous timestep | 10:55 |
| fijal | it should work no? | 10:56 |
| fijal | it's funny | 10:56 |
| fijal | it not only differs, but also differs cpython/pypy drastically | 10:56 |
| mattip | yes, sorry, gotta go :(. Later. | 10:57 |
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| CIA-13 | 03arigo 07roundup * 10#945/import shadowing module from __init__.py as __main__ fails: | 10:57 |
| CIA-13 | Ah, maybe I found a way around these issues of modules being built-in in pypy, | 10:57 |
| CIA-13 | shadowing user-defined modules. How about we rename all seldom-us ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue945 | 10:57 |
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| fijal | ok, got it | 11:01 |
| CIA-13 | 03masklinn 07roundup * 10#946/timeit-as-CLI does not accept import: | 11:02 |
| CIA-13 | > Macports is buggy, please report it as a bug there. | 11:02 |
| CIA-13 | Yep, that's what I'm in the process of doing right now :) * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue946 | 11:02 |
| CIA-13 | 03afa 07roundup * 10#945/import shadowing module from __init__.py as __main__ fails: | 11:05 |
| CIA-13 | For a definition of a "normal" list of builtin modules, we could use the CPython | 11:05 |
| CIA-13 | files Modules/Setup* * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue945 | 11:05 |
| fijal | arigato: I found a JIT bug I believe | 11:05 |
| fijal | interested? | 11:06 |
| fijal | works with --jit off | 11:06 |
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| arigato | fijal: yes? | 11:09 |
| fijal | arigato: so can you checkout fijal/hack2 | 11:09 |
| fijal | https://bitbucket.org/fijal/hack2 | 11:10 |
| fijal | this one | 11:10 |
| fijal | there is bench/laplace/laplace.py | 11:10 |
| fijal | if you run it as it is right now, it should print different things depending on --jit off or not | 11:10 |
| fijal | I have a reasonably recent pypy-c in /tmp/usession-default-20367 | 11:11 |
| fijal | on tannit | 11:11 |
| __pv | btw, if you are wondering about numpy's semantics for a[...] = b when a and b share memory: it's actually undefined, but there was a consensus that it should always be equivalent to a[...] = b.copy() | 11:11 |
| fijal | or /home/fijal/pypy/compiled/c-bef722513f6c-default | 11:11 |
| fijal | __pv: not that it works that way | 11:12 |
| __pv | that it's not, is to some degree a bug in numpy (so if you can avoid that in pypy, that would be good) | 11:12 |
| fijal | ah ok | 11:12 |
| fijal | yes, we can avoid that | 11:12 |
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| fijal | arigato: can you reproduce? | 11:17 |
| __pv | the thing to watch out are the temporaries, as I've heard some people saying that they rely on this type of operations not making copies of whole arrays because of memory limits | 11:17 |
| arigato | fijal: sorry, lunchtime | 11:18 |
| fijal | arigato: cool :) | 11:18 |
| fijal | __pv: we're avoiding a lot of temporaries already | 11:18 |
| fijal | but we also have to do something (maybe) with freeing stuff in time | 11:18 |
| fijal | arigato: uh, I also fail to understand the code | 11:20 |
| fijal | there is a floatobject allocated before jump | 11:21 |
| fijal | but it's not like it's ever passed anywhere | 11:21 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/732 [12ctismer, win64-stage1] | 11:22 |
| djc | btw, would you guys be interested in taking some of these? http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/dev-python/pypy/files/1.7-patches.patch?revision=1.1&view=markup | 11:24 |
| djc | those are the patches we currently carry for gentoo | 11:24 |
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| djc | maybe they aren't elegant, but we can find something to fix the behavior or allow passing in options instead of patching things up | 11:25 |
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| fijal | djc: what are translate.py changes doing? | 11:49 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 117db85588c567 15/pypy/translator/: Kill dependency on "isstartblock". | 12:04 |
| kenaan | 12arigo default 1170c53e1231ad 15/pypy/: Get rid of 'isstartblock'. | 12:04 |
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| arigato | fijal: ok, can you point me again to a recent pypy-c? | 12:06 |
| arigato | preferrably an already-built one | 12:06 |
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| fijal | /home/fijal/pypy/compiled/c-bef722513f6c-default | 12:08 |
| fijal | on tannit | 12:08 |
| fijal | arigato: hm | 12:08 |
| fijal | how did it copy-paste stuff starting with / here? | 12:08 |
| fijal | did you get the link? | 12:09 |
| fijal | or the directory | 12:09 |
| arigato | this is the C sources only | 12:10 |
| fijal | pypy-c-bef.... | 12:12 |
| fijal | in the parent dir is the compiled one | 12:12 |
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| arigato | thank you | 12:13 |
| fijal | arigato: sorry for miscommunication, it all "obviously" comes from done.py | 12:13 |
| fijal | cfbolz: hi carl | 12:13 |
| cfbolz | 'ello | 12:13 |
| fijal | arigato: it looks worrying that there is a forced virtual that does not go anywhere | 12:14 |
| fijal | (besides the fact that wrong results are more worrying) | 12:14 |
| arigato | well you need to dig... | 12:16 |
| arigato | there are far too many unknowns for me to start digging right now, like numpy | 12:17 |
| fijal | yes, for both things | 12:17 |
| fijal | well | 12:17 |
| fijal | --jit off works | 12:17 |
| fijal | also the only numpy loop is .copy() | 12:17 |
| fijal | it's relatively easy to get rid of it | 12:17 |
| arigato | please do | 12:17 |
| fijal | ok | 12:17 |
| Action: fijal does | 12:17 | |
| arigato | if you can reduce the test case, it would be a huge help | 12:18 |
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| fijal | hm | 12:19 |
| fijal | I'll try | 12:20 |
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| fijal | arigato: ok, so it is numpy | 12:26 |
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| fijal | assembler looks fine though | 12:31 |
| fijal | nedbat: hi | 12:31 |
| nedbat | hi. just saw your tweet | 12:32 |
| fijal | yes, tests are good :) | 12:32 |
| nedbat | I agree. I was also told something different by someone here: http://paste.pound-python.org/show/15202/ | 12:33 |
| fijal | tests are still good :) | 12:34 |
| fijal | you don't have to write them but we strongly encourage | 12:34 |
| nedbat | fijal: and I have every intention of writing them. I'm still trying to figure out how this works, and saving my work on bitbucket and using it to share with my hosting are helping me. | 12:35 |
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| fijal | cool | 12:35 |
| fijal | well, it's just not what we usually do | 12:35 |
| nedbat | fijal: did you look at the marshal change? I didn't make it in the marshal module itself, what are your thoughts on that. | 12:36 |
| fijal | I think it's a good place | 12:36 |
| fijal | no, no, the marshal module has to stay the way it is | 12:36 |
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| nedbat | ok, i wasn't sure whether it was better to put marshally stuff in sandlib or s_StatResult stuff in marshal. Neither seemed perfect. | 12:36 |
| fijal | you should remove dependency on s_StatResult | 12:37 |
| fijal | and use some other object for that | 12:37 |
| fijal | it's just there to signal the type | 12:37 |
| fijal | can be like stat_result_type = object() | 12:37 |
| nedbat | oh, i see, because sender and receiver are in the same file. | 12:38 |
| nedbat | btw: another way to fix this would be to have the sandbox's marshal be a little more forgiving, then we could use marshal.dump(tuple(msg)) | 12:38 |
| fijal | uh no? | 12:38 |
| fijal | where is receiver? | 12:39 |
| fijal | it doesn't matter because you only use it to signal on the function/method | 12:39 |
| nedbat | fijal: yes, and the resulttype attribute is also assigned in this file. Sorry, not sender/receiver. | 12:40 |
| fijal | ok :) | 12:41 |
| nedbat | fijal: btw, this change reduced my server's response time by 43%, from 1.98s to 1.13s. :) | 12:44 |
| fijal | are you invoking sandbox per-request? | 12:44 |
| fijal | to clean up the state? | 12:44 |
| nedbat | fijal: per-request, and on very small python scripts, so the startup time is most of the time. | 12:45 |
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| nedbat | I'm thinking about ways to keep the process long-running, but would have to firewall each invocation then. | 12:45 |
| fijal | probably you would want to do a fork() or something | 12:45 |
| fijal | but yeah, it does sound like a bit more work | 12:45 |
| nedbat | these are good changes to make anyway, and it's getting close to a reasonable response time. | 12:46 |
| nedbat | fijal: my next issue will be RAM footprint likely. | 12:46 |
| fijal | right | 12:46 |
| fijal | nedbat: you should get rid of all the imports | 12:47 |
| fijal | all the pypy imports | 12:47 |
| fijal | also probably the hosting process can stay online | 12:47 |
| fijal | PyPy has unfortunately pretty large basic RAM footprint :/ | 12:47 |
| fijal | not much I can do about it | 12:47 |
| fijal | I mean there are ways, but no *easy* way | 12:47 |
| nedbat | yeah, i was afraid of that. | 12:47 |
| exarkun | How about shared mmap'd pyc access and jit pages | 12:48 |
| exarkun | How hard could it be | 12:48 |
| exarkun | :) | 12:48 |
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| fijal | nedbat: we can think about ways | 12:49 |
| fijal | sharing the basic interpreter would be a good first step | 12:49 |
| nedbat | exarkun: I welcome your help! :) | 12:49 |
| exarkun | nedbat: Every time I think I might have some time to hack on PyPy, I'm wrong :( | 12:50 |
| fijal | nedbat: anyway, get rid of nonsense first | 12:50 |
| fijal | and maybe share the hosting process | 12:50 |
| fijal | so you don't have to invoke pypy *and* cpython each time | 12:50 |
| nedbat | fijal: the hosting process is my wsgi process. | 12:51 |
| fijal | ok? | 12:51 |
| fijal | well, why do you have to import sandlib for each invocation? | 12:52 |
| nedbat | maybe I'm misunderstanding something. | 12:53 |
| fijal | yes? | 12:53 |
| fijal | so explain what you understand :) | 12:53 |
| fijal | maybe I'm misunderstanding something | 12:53 |
| nedbat | ok, sec | 12:54 |
| nedbat | fijal: I'm not sure why it would be imported more than once. | 12:56 |
| nedbat | sandlib isn't used in the sandbox proc? | 12:57 |
| fijal | I don't believe it is | 12:57 |
| nedbat | mm, nope, it isn't. | 12:57 |
| fijal | no, it's the external process | 12:58 |
| nedbat | like I said, there's much here that still confuses me. | 12:59 |
| nedbat | perhaps my wsgi processes aren't behaving as I thought. This is shared hosting. | 13:01 |
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| fijal | it's all well and good, but you would gain a bit if it was not the case | 13:02 |
| nedbat | fijal: yes, I'll look into that. | 13:02 |
| fijal | arigato: http://dpaste.com/663813/ | 13:03 |
| fijal | a minimal example | 13:03 |
| nedbat | are there any available switches that would reduce ram usage, at the expense of speed? | 13:03 |
| fijal | yes, various GC options | 13:04 |
| fijal | but I believe your hosting process which imports half of pypy might be the bottleneck now | 13:04 |
| fijal | get rid of nonsense first | 13:04 |
| nedbat | good advice | 13:05 |
| cfbolz | nedbat: thanks for fighting this stuff | 13:08 |
| fijal | nedbat: yes, indeed, we're glad that someone cares about it :) | 13:08 |
| nedbat | if I write tests, will you tell me what the low-mem GC options are? :) | 13:09 |
| fijal | hehehe | 13:09 |
| fijal | I can tell you either way | 13:09 |
| fijal | they're at the beginning of pypy/rpython/memory/gc/minimark.py I believe | 13:09 |
| Action: fijal checks | 13:09 | |
| fijal | yes | 13:10 |
| fijal | but you have to figure out what's consuming your memory | 13:10 |
| fijal | they'll only affect heap of the program | 13:10 |
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| fijal | so not for example the base interpreter size | 13:10 |
| nedbat | I see, thanks. | 13:10 |
| nedbat | How can I see in a running pypy what GC is in use? | 13:11 |
| fijal | it's minimark | 13:11 |
| fijal | but you can say by sys.translation_info? | 13:12 |
| fijal | sys.pypy_translation_info['translation.gc'] | 13:12 |
| fijal | nedbat: to be precise | 13:12 |
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| nedbat | I have 'generation'. | 13:13 |
| nedbat | I think --sandbox forces it to that. | 13:13 |
| nedbat | or defaults it at least. | 13:13 |
| fijal | ok | 13:13 |
| fijal | yeah, maybe | 13:13 |
| nedbat | but that's to get the --heapsize control, which doesn't seem to work for me, another issue to track down. | 13:13 |
| fijal | why it does not work? | 13:14 |
| djc | fijal: re those patches, the translate.py changes are evidently disabling the debugger | 13:15 |
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| djc | not sure why we needed that | 13:15 |
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| djc | did the other patches look ok? | 13:15 |
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| fijal | nedbat: sorry got disconnected | 13:17 |
| nedbat | fijal: I don't know why it doesn't work, I know that in my sandbox prompt, I can make lists with millions of elements that should be prevented by --heapsize. Unless that's another thing I don't understand yet. | 13:17 |
| fijal | did you make a list using range by chance? | 13:18 |
| nedbat | :) | 13:18 |
| nedbat | what should I use? | 13:19 |
| nedbat | i'm down the rabbithole again... | 13:19 |
| nedbat | range(10) gives me a list. | 13:19 |
| nedbat | are they not fully realized? | 13:19 |
| exarkun | That rings a bell. | 13:20 |
| fijal | yeah ;-) | 13:20 |
| fijal | range() is lazy | 13:20 |
| exarkun | What if you insert a random value in the middle? | 13:20 |
| fijal | [0] * large_number | 13:20 |
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| fijal | for example | 13:20 |
| fijal | exarkun: it forces it | 13:20 |
| fijal | exarkun: even append forces it | 13:20 |
| exarkun | Or remove? | 13:20 |
| fijal | yeah, all this stuff | 13:20 |
| fijal | I think reverse and sort don't | 13:21 |
| exarkun | PyPy is too surprising. Removing a value from a list shouldn't fail with a memory error. You should make PyPy simpler. | 13:21 |
| exarkun | Like CPython. | 13:21 |
| fijal | yeah, maybe | 13:21 |
| nedbat | exarkun: I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not. | 13:21 |
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| exarkun | nedbat: That's my super power. | 13:22 |
| fijal | nedbat: that is often a problem with exarkun | 13:22 |
| nedbat | ok, nevermind, --heapsize works fine. It's range() that's broken! :) | 13:22 |
| cfbolz | nedbat: well "broken" :-) | 13:25 |
| nedbat | (I had a smiley, something exarkun could learn...) | 13:25 |
| cfbolz | I'm sure he could use smileys that still clarify nothing | 13:25 |
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| kenaan | 12l.diekmann default 11748818c5a463 15/pypy/objspace/std/: added floatstrategy for lists | 13:54 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: ping | 13:54 |
| kenaan | 12l.diekmann default 116d12edf0639c 15/pypy/: merge | 13:54 |
| fijal | cfbolz: cool stuff! | 13:54 |
| fijal | cfbolz: can we think about unicode strategy? | 13:54 |
| Rhyolite | fijal: pong | 13:54 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: can I borrow your mind for a second about gcc performance? | 13:54 |
| Rhyolite | okay | 13:54 |
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| Action: fijal waits for push to finish | 13:56 | |
| fijal | go here | 13:56 |
| fijal | https://bitbucket.org/fijal/hack2/src/default/bench/laplace | 13:56 |
| fijal | there is a laplace.cxx and inline_laplace.cxx | 13:56 |
| fijal | they contain quite a bit of cruft | 13:56 |
| fijal | https://bitbucket.org/fijal/hack2/src/default/bench/laplace/laplace.cxx#cl-126 | 13:56 |
| fijal | this is the interesting part though | 13:56 |
| fijal | so algorithms are different but not by much | 13:57 |
| fijal | one converges in 278 steps and takes 5.8s | 13:57 |
| fijal | the onther in 219 steps and takes 1.4s | 13:57 |
| fijal | now, it does not seem vectorization is different | 13:57 |
| fijal | (I run it with -fno-tree-vectorize) | 13:57 |
| fijal | and in pypy they both take the same time (proportionally to the number of steps) | 13:58 |
| kenaan | 12cfbolz default 115a5d0bfd04c9 15/pypy/rlib/jit.py: don't use specialize.ll for these calls, but call_location instead. otherwise you cannot use is_constant on high-l... | 13:58 |
| fijal | what sort of optimization changes it? | 13:58 |
| Rhyolite | which two are you comparing? | 13:59 |
| fijal | inline_laplace.cxx and laplace.cxx | 13:59 |
| cfbolz | fijal: yes, a unicode strategy is trivial to add | 14:00 |
| cfbolz | fijal: we should check how much one strategy adds to the size of the executable | 14:00 |
| Rhyolite | fijal: so the difference is scalar vs array for tmp? | 14:01 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: the difference is modifying array in place vs from a copy | 14:01 |
| fijal | so there are definite differences | 14:02 |
| fijal | but I kind of fail to observe what sort of optimization changes everything | 14:03 |
| Rhyolite | yes, but if you change it in place, you are using the new values in the computation | 14:03 |
| fijal | ye syes | 14:04 |
| Rhyolite | you're mixing steps | 14:04 |
| fijal | sure | 14:04 |
| Rhyolite | that will affect convergence | 14:04 |
| fijal | it is a different algorithm, I said it before | 14:04 |
| Rhyolite | okay | 14:04 |
| fijal | yes, hence a different number of steps | 14:04 |
| fijal | so on pypy the change of algo affects convergence, but it does not affect performance | 14:04 |
| fijal | where is the trick? | 14:05 |
| Rhyolite | sorry have to run | 14:05 |
| fijal | ok | 14:05 |
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| kenaan | 12cfbolz int-tag-untag-as-operations 112c073a10379f 15/pypy/: merge default | 14:08 |
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| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1872 [12Carl Friedrich Bolz, int-tag-untag-as-operations] | 14:17 |
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| Rhyolite | fjial: back | 14:22 |
| Rhyolite | did you look at the code produced by GCC? | 14:22 |
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| kenaan | 12l.diekmann default 11b326a8bec1a2 15/pypy/objspace/std/test/test_listobject.py: added some tests for listobject with floats | 14:23 |
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| Nick change: fijal_ -> fijal | 15:05 | |
| fijal | Rhyolite: you made a typo in my nick, I haven't seen it :) | 15:05 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: I failed mostly | 15:05 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: I tried, but c++ eludes me | 15:05 |
| Rhyolite | I'll try to look later | 15:06 |
| Rhyolite | I can imagine that the scalar temporary vs array provides different optimization opportunities | 15:06 |
| fijal | it's not about scalar temporary | 15:06 |
| fijal | it's about unrolling maybe? | 15:06 |
| Rhyolite | what options are you using? | 15:12 |
| fijal | -O3 | 15:12 |
| Rhyolite | -O3? -funroll-loops? | 15:12 |
| bbot2 | 4Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1872 [12Carl Friedrich Bolz, int-tag-untag-as-operations] | 15:16 |
| fijal | no -f | 15:16 |
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| __pv | how big is the difference? on a slow eee minilaptop, I see 0.035 iter/s (laplace) and 0.032 iter/s (inline_laplace) with -O3, -O0, and -O3 -march=native | 15:19 |
| Rhyolite | I assume he's testing on nehalem or sandy bridge | 15:20 |
| Rhyolite | not atom | 15:20 |
| fijal | Rhyolite: no, an older one | 15:20 |
| fijal | i7 | 15:21 |
| fijal | L 620 | 15:21 |
| __pv | on a less silly AMD 64, I get 0.0142 iter/s (laplace) and 0.023 iter/s (inline_laplace) | 15:21 |
| Alex_Gaynor | i7 is naehelm or sandy bridge IIRC | 15:21 |
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| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: I've been thinking more about the forcing issue. Basically we need refcounting :/ | 15:23 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: yes :/ | 15:23 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: also other stuff | 15:23 |
| Alex_Gaynor | (aka, requires more thought) | 15:23 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: I have a JIT issue | 15:23 |
| fijal | feel like investigating? | 15:24 |
| Alex_Gaynor | I don't have a ton of time, but I guess sure | 15:24 |
| fijal | http://paste.pocoo.org/show/514951/ | 15:24 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: what's the issue? | 15:24 |
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| Rhyolite | fijal: I don't believe that loop unrolling is enabled by default at any optimization level | 15:25 |
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| fijal | it generates nonsense | 15:27 |
| Rhyolite | fijal: I don't believe that loop unrolling is enabled by default at any optimization level | 15:27 |
| Rhyolite | fijal: basically, that big a difference means one probably is generating extra memory traffic | 15:28 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: could it be the same issue as http://paste.pocoo.org/show/469313/ | 15:28 |
| Alex_Gaynor | (https://bugs.pypy.org/issue859) | 15:28 |
| kenaan | 12alex_gaynor numpy-dtype-refactor 112e67585de373 15/pypy/: merged default in | 15:30 |
| kenaan | 12alex_gaynor numpy-dtype-refactor 1126a0320190db 15/pypy/: merged default in | 15:30 |
| fijal | could be? | 15:30 |
| __pv | if it's a memory issue, valgrind's cachegrind might help verifying it | 15:30 |
| fijal | no, probably could not be | 15:30 |
| fijal | __pv: no, it cannot | 15:30 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: well, this one crashes precisely one iteration after the JIT kicks in | 15:31 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: well, this one is not about zeroing | 15:31 |
| fijal | it's about copying not working or so | 15:31 |
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| __pv | fijal: the performance issue, cache miss counts could be different | 15:32 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: hi! | 15:32 |
| fijal | __pv: right | 15:32 |
| fijal | stakkars_: hi | 15:32 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: so yeah, I spent the entire day chasing dudes like this, didn't have time to review anything | 15:33 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: do you know how to use the extra parameters of the build bot "force build" page? | 15:33 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: yours should be easy no? | 15:33 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: on what iteration does yours crash? it looks like mine works ok in the preamble, and fails in the first iteration of the loop | 15:33 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: pff,I have no idea | 15:33 |
| fijal | stakkars_: what do you want to pass? | 15:33 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: you look who calls what in asm | 15:34 |
| Action: fijal does | 15:34 | |
| stakkars_ | I would like so set parameters, like "-x', to have all tests stop after the first failure | 15:34 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: i44 = call(ConstClass(_ll_1_raw_malloc__Signed), i31, descr=<NonGcPtrCallDescr>); what more do you want? | 15:34 |
| fijal | stakkars_: I don't think you can do that | 15:35 |
| fijal | nice | 15:36 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: so ll_1_raw_malloc__Signed happily ignores all the fuckin flags | 15:36 |
| stakkars_ | I want kind of overview, but the BB spends too much time in useless tests which cannot work (i.e. setup errors) and spoil the info that I need | 15:36 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: you mean like zero=True? | 15:36 |
| fijal | like zero=True, add_memory_pressure=False | 15:36 |
| fijal | or True | 15:36 |
| fijal | etc. | 15:36 |
| Alex_Gaynor | pfffffff | 15:36 |
| fijal | pfffff indeed | 15:37 |
| fijal | I found it, feel like fixing? ;-) | 15:37 |
| fijal | I can fix it | 15:37 |
| stakkars_ | ok, then I will add a bit to buildbot, for instance an auto-skip if there is a general setup error | 15:37 |
| Alex_Gaynor | I gotta get ready and go to class in like 2 minutes, so if you could that'd be good | 15:37 |
| antocuni | stakkars_: I think that your best option is to modify the testrunner directly in the branch | 15:38 |
| fijal | stakkars_: there be dragons | 15:38 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: that would explain why zeros() in a loop is so slow :) | 15:38 |
| fijal | because it does not add memory_pressure | 15:38 |
| stakkars_ | antocuni: ah, yes of course. | 15:38 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: well, and there's tons of nonsense in there, e.g. find_shape isn't traced | 15:38 |
| antocuni | so that it runs py.test -x instead of py.test | 15:38 |
| fijal | but it's also mess for things like hashlib etc. | 15:38 |
| fijal | nice... | 15:38 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: "dragons" ??? :-) | 15:39 |
| antocuni | but then you have to remember not to merge it :-) | 15:39 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: hashlib is "safe" since it isn't inlined | 15:39 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: well, are you sure? | 15:39 |
| fijal | rsocket? | 15:39 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: I'm sure it's an issue somewhere, just saying, not in hashlib | 15:39 |
| fijal | okey | 15:39 |
| fijal | not that it helps | 15:39 |
| fijal | ok, I'll fix it | 15:39 |
| Alex_Gaynor | thanks | 15:39 |
| Action: fijal is sure there is an xxx somewhere in codewriter | 15:40 | |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: why does it work in preamble, pure chance? | 15:40 |
| fijal | dunno | 15:40 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: there's an invalid XXX in that function, but it's unrelated and wrong | 15:40 |
| fijal | I don't think it does | 15:40 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: oh nvm, it works in tracing maybe | 15:40 |
| fijal | ya | 15:40 |
| stakkars_ | ok, I will also add something that lets test runner keep the temp files of failed tests. | 15:40 |
| Alex_Gaynor | that's pure chance as well I guess | 15:41 |
| stakkars_ | because whenever I want to look at something that fails on BB (but works locally), I don't see what is wrong with the tent files, which are gone through all the later tests | 15:42 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: note that we need refcounting baaadly | 15:42 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: let's find a better way to say that ;) | 15:42 |
| Alex_Gaynor | I'll think on it. | 15:43 |
| Action: Alex_Gaynor -> awayish | 15:43 | |
| setmeaway | i think pypy doesn't consider shared-library version in ll2ctypes.py:get_ctypes_callable. is it intended one? | 15:43 |
| fijal | nice | 15:45 |
| fijal | there are no raw_malloc tests in codewriter | 15:45 |
| setmeaway | for example if it found libexpat.dll.a, then pypy may not assume dll is libexpat.dll because of version postfix. | 15:55 |
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| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: of course not, if there were tests there wouldn't be bugs ;) | 15:58 |
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| fijal | pushing... | 16:05 |
| fijal | santagada: ping | 16:06 |
| santagada | fijal, pong | 16:06 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: is it just me or is pushing slower lately? | 16:06 |
| fijal | what do you need lxml for? | 16:06 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: for me it takes ~1m | 16:06 |
| fijal | 30s maybe | 16:06 |
| fijal | it's fast from tannit though | 16:06 |
| fijal | (???) | 16:06 |
| santagada | fijal, openerp uses lxml... I just wanted to test it with pypy | 16:06 |
| fijal | openerp is...? | 16:07 |
| santagada | but I think the only problems openerp has with speed is very badly written code | 16:07 |
| santagada | fijal, and ERP software | 16:07 |
| fijal | pypy does not fix those | 16:07 |
| santagada | yep | 16:07 |
| santagada | so I don't think it will matter much | 16:07 |
| fijal | my DNS is screwed though | 16:07 |
| fijal | I can't push | 16:08 |
| fijal | :/ | 16:08 |
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| santagada | I wish I could start using pypy daily | 16:08 |
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| fijal | ah no, that's pulling that's fast on tannit | 16:09 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: so yes | 16:09 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: ? | 16:09 |
| kenaan | 12fijal default 1105689cbd7389 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/: raise an exception instead of producing bogus code. Probably would turn some stuff into calls instead of jitcodes | 16:09 |
| kenaan | 12fijal default 11741dd1c718ca 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/: support some combination of flags, I hope it's good enough | 16:09 |
| kenaan | 12fijal default 11f997f3ff2594 15/pypy/: merge | 16:09 |
| fijal | pushing is slow | 16:09 |
| fijal | arigato: ^^^ | 16:09 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: is it bitbucket or our hooks? | 16:10 |
| fijal | hooks run after no? | 16:10 |
| Alex_Gaynor | maybe | 16:10 |
| fijal | santagada: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enterprise_resource_planning | 16:10 |
| fijal | ? | 16:10 |
| fijal | is this for whoever you work for? | 16:10 |
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| santagada | fijal, yes, I'm working on a company that does OpenERP development | 16:11 |
| fijal | cool, maybe you can make them pay for lxml | 16:11 |
| fijal | real is pretty strong these days, it would be cheap | 16:11 |
| santagada | the problem is that running on pypy would buy us nothing... the orm on openerp is so bad that even if you rewrite the algos in assembly writting directly to memory it would still be slow | 16:13 |
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| santagada | If I'm going to convince someone to pay anything for pypy is for numpy or better stackless support | 16:14 |
| santagada | another interesting thing would be gevent/gunicorn or uwsgi support | 16:14 |
| fijal | does it buy anything for your employer? | 16:14 |
| Alex_Gaynor | gunicorn+eventlet works, AFAIK | 16:14 |
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| arigato | anyone wants to sponsor us rewriting cPickle? :-) | 16:25 |
| arigato | we get good performance speed-ups from plain pickle.py, but still not quite up to CPython's cPickle level | 16:26 |
| fijal | arigato: we're not doing very well on "anyone wants to sponsor us doing ..." | 16:26 |
| fijal | [insert your thing here] | 16:27 |
| arigato | yes, it's easier to go for "pay for your favourite feature and we'll implement it" | 16:27 |
| arigato | to some extent | 16:27 |
| fijal | well, maybe | 16:27 |
| fijal | we don't quite know yet | 16:27 |
| arigato | yes | 16:27 |
| lucian | it seems odd to me that companies that use python aren't jumping all over pypy | 16:28 |
| santagada | fijal, nope, but it would be cool as hell | 16:28 |
| santagada | I think pickle is small enough that something like that would work | 16:29 |
| arigato | yes, agreed | 16:29 |
| santagada | arigato, any ideas on how much money would it take? | 16:29 |
| arigato | no clue | 16:29 |
| santagada | I think zodb guys would pay it | 16:29 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: btw, anyone wants to sponsor us supporting Windows 64bit? | 16:29 |
| santagada | there are people really interested in zodb on pypy | 16:30 |
| santagada | and pickle performance is the pinacle of zodb (and then the b-tree implementation) | 16:30 |
| stakkars_ | I should seriously consider that. It is so much work | 16:30 |
| santagada | persistence is probably fast now | 16:30 |
| arigato | stakkars_: maybe, but this comes with a risk too: I certainly won't accept money if the contract says implicitly "and you're going to maintain Win64 forever" | 16:31 |
| santagada | stakkars_, also another project that I think could work better than python 3/numpy | 16:31 |
| santagada | arigato, good point | 16:31 |
| arigato | stakkars_: but if you are fine with that, then sure | 16:31 |
| fijal | santagada: I would have an estimate of pickle for about a week of work | 16:32 |
| arigato | stakkars_: if you're getting a contract getting you money, then I'll be on the sidelines doing the cheering :-) | 16:32 |
| fijal | which means that when it comes to signing I would say 2 weeks | 16:33 |
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| stakkars_ | arigato: well, if I can make a contract for this, then I will make sure that nobody of the PyPy crew will be forced to support Win64. | 16:34 |
| Action: arigato -> dinner | 16:35 | |
| stakkars_ | At least I would separate that out in a way that nobody but maybe me gets forced, if at all. | 16:35 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: I'd appreciate your cheering | 16:35 |
| fijal | stakkars_: I don't think you even can contractually sign anything that will force anyone else to do pretty mch anything :) | 16:36 |
| fijal | a lot of any in this sentence | 16:36 |
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| fijal | what I meant is you can only promise what you'll do :) | 16:36 |
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| stakkars_ | fijal: maybe. :-) | 16:36 |
| fijal | as far as I know this is how it works :) | 16:37 |
| fijal | but obviously you can lie to people ;-) | 16:37 |
| fijal | and make it their problem | 16:37 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: I think I would reject to be forced into anything, and it never happened so far. | 16:38 |
| fijal | cool :) | 16:38 |
| fijal | stakkars_: well, windows 64 sounds like a really sane goal | 16:38 |
| fijal | a paid goal even | 16:38 |
| fijal | but I have no clue who is a potential customer, sorry :( | 16:39 |
| stakkars_ | I didn't think of it, yet. But it is reasonable, but still much work. | 16:39 |
| stakkars_ | I spent over a month now, and I guess it takes the same time again, if not more. | 16:39 |
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| stakkars_ | well, I think to write a bit about the problem, and the fact that I got "rpystonedalone" to run almost correctly. | 16:42 |
| fijal | stakkars_: I think it would be interesting to post a blog post on the pypy blog about that | 16:43 |
| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 1168ed886b303c 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/codebuilder.py: Ensure exlusive usage of r0 in b_abs | 16:43 |
| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 1197cfa93958c4 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/ppc_assembler.py: Ensure exclusive usage of r0 | 16:43 |
| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 112da6b07d24ec 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/test/test_call_assembler.py: add test for direct call of assembler code | 16:43 |
| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 117f81c8cd30bc 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/ppc_assembler.py: enable direct bootstrap code | 16:43 |
| fijal | stakkars_: so you're more than welcome to write something | 16:43 |
| stakkars_ | doing a public request "I would like to finish that, I need XXX $$$, please donate" | 16:43 |
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| fijal | I think for "donate" it would be a bit more complex | 16:44 |
| fijal | but we can always say "please contact Christian for more details" | 16:44 |
| fijal | "donate" is also doable | 16:44 |
| stakkars_ | whatever irks, fine with me. | 16:44 |
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| fijal | stakkars_: I have no clue myself, just saying :) | 16:45 |
| fijal | I think it's fine to leave it as in "contact christian" | 16:45 |
| fijal | but we can also run an official campaign | 16:45 |
| fijal | the correct guy to ask about this is bradley though | 16:45 |
| fijal | or pypy-z | 16:45 |
| stakkars_ | why is "donate" complicated? I'm thinking of my success with Starship, where I financed a new server in no time. And everybody was listed on a "page of honor" :-) | 16:46 |
| fijal | lucky you :) | 16:46 |
| fijal | we had less luck with numpy & py3k so far | 16:46 |
| stakkars_ | yes, which is sad. | 16:46 |
| exarkun | Something like $8000 have been donated towards numpy and py3k | 16:47 |
| exarkun | If you were only trying to buy a new server you'd have been done a long time ago | 16:47 |
| stakkars_ | well, with Starship it was just 3000 bucks, and I asked only the PSA members (300 people) | 16:47 |
| fijal | exarkun: I guess also less people would get excited | 16:47 |
| fijal | exarkun: there is a lot of unsexy work | 16:47 |
| fijal | like I don't think buildbot maintenance would fly well | 16:48 |
| santagada | maybe another approach to things would be to try to gather new people to work on pypy, writting blog posts is a good start | 16:48 |
| stakkars_ | well, you must rap that work into other work. And not talk about it | 16:49 |
| santagada | I think the blog is what made pypy visible to the outside world | 16:49 |
| fijal | santagada: that's probably the best thing I ever did in pypy | 16:49 |
| fijal | [create the blog] | 16:49 |
| santagada | fijal, also your blog is very cool too | 16:49 |
| stakkars_ | santagada: we need new people, but not an alternative to getting money ;-) | 16:49 |
| santagada | stakkars_, if a company donates a developer time, it is almost the same thing as money :) | 16:50 |
| santagada | stakkars_, better yet, you don't have to work on windows :D | 16:50 |
| fijal | santagada: I disagree | 16:50 |
| fijal | I prefer money to people | 16:50 |
| fijal | because otherwise I have to go and find some other job | 16:51 |
| santagada | ah | 16:51 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: you did that? That was absolutely correct and insaneously great to do | 16:51 |
| stakkars_ | santagada: I'm talking about me. I have too much time ;-) | 16:51 |
| santagada | fijal, you should try to find a proper job that you can work on pypy | 16:51 |
| fijal | santagada: fail so far | 16:51 |
| santagada | fijal, for example, google could hire you to work 50% on pypy or something | 16:51 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: apropos: I'm in the progress of finding new people in Berlin. | 16:51 |
| fijal | google wanted to hire me for 100% time on V8 so far | 16:52 |
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| fijal | writing C++ | 16:52 |
| stakkars_ | starting with a weekly meeting with an interested guy, who wants to work on PyPy. | 16:52 |
| santagada | fijal, on google you would have 20% to work on pypy | 16:52 |
| fijal | stakkars_: would be cool to have some people who want to pay for pypy :) | 16:52 |
| fijal | santagada: except almost nobody does that | 16:52 |
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| fijal | anyway | 16:52 |
| fijal | that's not the point | 16:52 |
| Action: fijal off for dinner | 16:53 | |
| fijal | I'll read logs later | 16:53 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: thatks, I need motivation, and you did that | 16:53 |
| fijal | stakkars_: I think it's sellable now more than ever | 16:53 |
| fijal | but still, I fail at doing so | 16:53 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: well, I sold it almost, fortunately it did not work ;-) | 16:54 |
| fijal | :] | 16:54 |
| stakkars_ | but I think win64 is sellable to CCP | 16:54 |
| fijal | ya, might be | 16:55 |
| fijal | we did stackless | 16:55 |
| fijal | stackless & jit integration might be as well | 16:55 |
| stakkars_ | fijal: you know the need for speed sprint? I was so far that PyPy got invited | 16:55 |
| rguillebert | AFAIK they need to embed the interpreter | 16:55 |
| stakkars_ | yes, it is really a different time where we have really sexy stuff to sell. | 16:56 |
| stakkars_ | rguillebert: yes, at least they still thonk that. Wrong in the first place, but ok. | 16:56 |
| rguillebert | they call python code that calls C code that call python code apparently | 16:57 |
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| stakkars_ | but as far as pypy is, I'd like to figure out if they might write everything in PyPy and toss the whole C++ mess | 16:58 |
| stakkars_ | rguillebert: I'm telling them since 12 years that they are producing their biggest problem. | 16:58 |
| rguillebert | I guess the 3D stuff still needs to be written in a GIL-less fast language | 16:59 |
| rguillebert | (unless you're talking of the server side) | 17:00 |
| rguillebert | and you probably are | 17:00 |
| stakkars_ | rguillebert: server side is the first thing, because that was the reason why they demanded a 64bit psyco. | 17:02 |
| stakkars_ | I have no clue how much stuff is on the server side that forces them to embed python? | 17:04 |
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| stakkars_ | will talk to them, soon. | 17:04 |
| rguillebert | if they use threads it's probably better | 17:04 |
| stakkars_ | what do you mean with "it" and "better"? | 17:05 |
| stakkars_ | both very ambiguous :-) | 17:05 |
| rguillebert | for concurrency :) | 17:05 |
| stakkars_ | what? threads better than what? Embedding better than what? Better in which quality? | 17:07 |
| stakkars_ | no that is very unclear. Their reason to use Stackless since the beginning is to avoid threads. | 17:08 |
| stakkars_ | And I'm the last one who recommends something else, naturally ;-) | 17:09 |
| rguillebert | yes if they don't use threads then extending is better | 17:09 |
| stakkars_ | still, what do you mean? Better for peed of programs, better for speed of programming, better for server cost, better for finding skilled people, &. Seriously, there is no one-dimensional 'better' | 17:11 |
| rguillebert | performance wise, because of the GIL | 17:12 |
| rguillebert | in the C code not called by python code, you don't have to care about it | 17:13 |
| stakkars_ | and a compromise between directions of quality is a mapping of multi into one dimension. The weighting of this vector function then is what you need to try to estimate, to understand the customer. (sorry for quibbling) | 17:14 |
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| rguillebert | I'm not saying that it's better, I'm saying that it's debatable | 17:14 |
| stakkars_ | ok, coming closer | 17:15 |
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| rguillebert | I said "probably better" but I misspoke | 17:16 |
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| stakkars_ | my strategy is to roll the possible paths out with some estimates and try to let the customer conclude what I want... | 17:17 |
| stakkars_ | well, leaving this. Too much theoretical talk, need to contact companies. | 17:20 |
| rguillebert | :) | 17:21 |
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| stakkars_ | pay for pypy | 17:22 |
| stakkars_ | paypy.org :-D | 17:22 |
| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 11eb0fdf36780a 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/ppc_assembler.py: fixed offset bug in loading parameters from stack | 17:25 |
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| kenaan | 12arigo default 11153c1281e1cb 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/: Add support for track_allocation=False (the default is True). We can't add many more flags while keeping the same s... | 18:16 |
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| chronitis | is copying __doc__ strings directly from pypy acceptable or discouraged? | 18:19 |
| chronitis | *directly from python | 18:19 |
| voidspace | to be recommended I would assume | 18:20 |
| voidspace | and where you improve them please submit the improved version back to python :-) | 18:20 |
| chronitis | fair enough | 18:21 |
| fijal | chronitis: yes | 18:23 |
| fijal | what voidspace says :) | 18:23 |
| kenaan | 12hakanardo jit-targets 110b4126532f16 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/: hack to support aliased virtuals | 18:28 |
| kenaan | 12hakanardo jit-targets 118dfc6aebd9b6 15/pypy/module/pypyjit/test_pypy_c/model.py: restrict match_by_id to ops in the peeled loop | 18:28 |
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| fijal | hakanardo: ping | 18:37 |
| hakanardo | hi | 18:38 |
| fijal | I have an issue with trace | 18:38 |
| fijal | I have an allocation that goes nowhere | 18:38 |
| fijal | that's forced at the jump, but is not passed anywhere | 18:38 |
| hakanardo | ok, sounds bad | 18:39 |
| fijal | how do you want me to show you that? | 18:39 |
| hakanardo | do you have a failing test? | 18:39 |
| fijal | no | 18:40 |
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| fijal | but I have a medium-size program | 18:40 |
| fijal | I can try to reduce it | 18:40 |
| hakanardo | ok, can you paste the trace? | 18:41 |
| fijal | yeah | 18:41 |
| hakanardo | I could stare at it for a while and hope for something to pop up... | 18:42 |
| fijal | http://paste.pocoo.org/show/515045/ | 18:42 |
| fijal | you can get the program from bitbucket/fijal/hack2 | 18:42 |
| fijal | https://bitbucket.org/fijal/hack2/src/default/bench/laplace/laplace.py | 18:43 |
| fijal | this one | 18:43 |
| fijal | just run it with no params | 18:43 |
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| hakanardo | which allocation is the problem? | 18:44 |
| hakanardo | pypy 1.7 is too old to run it? | 18:46 |
| Alex_Gaynor | arigato: I don't think we should rewrite cPickle, let's try to improve pickle.py | 18:47 |
| fijal | hakanardo: yes, you need nightly or grab something from my pypy dir on tannit | 18:48 |
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| fijal | /home/fijal/pypy/compiled/pypy-c-bef722513f6c-default | 18:49 |
| fijal | should do | 18:49 |
| fijal | hakanardo: there is new_with_vtable in a loop that should not be there | 18:49 |
| fijal | of FloatObject | 18:49 |
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| hakanardo | which box in the trace you pasted? | 18:49 |
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| fijal | hakanardo: can't you run it in jitviewer? | 18:50 |
| fijal | the first one | 18:50 |
| fijal | p91 = new_with_vtable(37095496) | 18:50 |
| CIA-13 | 03jayqhacker 07roundup * 10#791/Simple wordcount is significantly slower and fatter than CPython: | 18:51 |
| CIA-13 | Since this is my pet issue, I will keep plugging it until it's faster than | 18:51 |
| CIA-13 | CPython. :) I had high hopes for PyPy 1.7, but alas, only a moderate ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue791 | 18:51 |
| hakanardo | it is used by the same_as op | 18:54 |
| hakanardo | isnt same_as optimized out? | 18:54 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: I think this goes into the right direction. The need for cPickle is artificial. | 18:54 |
| fijal | hakanardo: well, yes, but then again same_as result is not used | 18:54 |
| hakanardo | but the same_as op is in the optimized traced | 18:55 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: isn't same_as killed in teh frontend? | 18:55 |
| hakanardo | so we have to produce the box to pass to same_as | 18:55 |
| fijal | apparently not | 18:55 |
| fijal | this is happy nonsense | 18:55 |
| Alex_Gaynor | what's even the point of a same_as op? | 18:55 |
| hakanardo | the the same_as was optimized out it would probably not be forces | 18:55 |
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| hakanardo | so why is the same_as not optimized out? | 18:56 |
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| fijal | hakanardo: did you notice it's forced by the jump? | 18:56 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: if we manage to get pickle.py fast, then we have reached a new quality | 18:56 |
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| Alex_Gaynor | stakkars_: we can always improve pickle.py itself, I have a patch that's worth 10-20% on it | 18:56 |
| fijal | stakkars_: we already have json encoding done that way | 18:56 |
| hakanardo | I think the forntend needs to same_as here to pass the same box in two places of the jump op | 18:57 |
| fijal | hakanardo: did you notice that none of them is doing that? | 18:57 |
| hakanardo | both p91 and p91 are among the jumpars, right? | 18:57 |
| fijal | no? | 18:57 |
| fijal | ah yes they're | 18:58 |
| fijal | so why is it not optimized away? | 18:58 |
| hakanardo | dunno | 18:58 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: because we then have managed to make an interpreter on top of the interpreter fast. I woult try this first, and then fall bach to RPython (==C) | 18:58 |
| fijal | hakanardo: it seems to me like this case is not handled correctly | 18:59 |
| fijal | when a virtual would appear in two places in the entry | 18:59 |
| hakanardo | there is no optimize_SAME_AS in optimizeopt/*.py? | 19:01 |
| fijal | :/ | 19:01 |
| stakkars_ | Alex_Gaynor: arigato: get me right, making the pickle engine fast on top of Python is the first multi-level JIT!!! | 19:01 |
| hakanardo | how are SAME_AS supposed to be removed? | 19:01 |
| hakanardo | fijal: there are tests with something like jump(p1, p1) and p1 virtual, checking these kind of cases | 19:02 |
| hakanardo | but probably noone using SAME_AS... | 19:02 |
| fijal | apparently does not work | 19:02 |
| fijal | with same_as | 19:02 |
| fijal | why is it using same_as anyway? | 19:03 |
| hakanardo | because we never optimize out SAME_AS? | 19:03 |
| fijal | why we ever generate it is my first question | 19:03 |
| stakkars_ | I think this generalisation really broadens the scope of Jit technology. | 19:03 |
| fijal | stakkars_: I don't think so | 19:05 |
| fijal | JITs has been done | 19:05 |
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| hakanardo | fijal: no clue why it's generated, but adding a optimize_SAME_AS killing the SAME_AS should fix your issue :) | 19:06 |
| fijal | okey | 19:06 |
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| stakkars_ | fijal: You think after the final Jot like now the end is reached? | 19:06 |
| Alex_Gaynor | def optimize_SAME_AS(self, op): self.make_equal_to(self.getvalue(op.getarg(0)), self.getvalue(op.getarg(1))) | 19:07 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: with a test :) | 19:07 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: pff, I'm not even sure this coe works | 19:07 |
| stakkars_ | Like "one level up" is "every level up"? Not sure | 19:07 |
| Alex_Gaynor | it looks about right though | 19:07 |
| fijal | I have no clue how optimizeopt works | 19:07 |
| Alex_Gaynor | really? | 19:08 |
| stakkars_ | s/jot/jit/ | 19:08 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: I wrote the original one with armin, but it was rewritten at least twice :) | 19:09 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: yes, now it's in more than one class for one ;) | 19:10 |
| fijal | it was always at least 2 | 19:10 |
| fijal | :) | 19:10 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: well, since hakanardo's refactor it's much nicer | 19:10 |
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| Action: arigato mentions a plug: http://armin-rigo.blogspot.com/ | 19:13 | |
| rguillebert | I guess I'm the first reader :p | 19:15 |
| arigato | no, it was read by various people already :-) | 19:15 |
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| antocuni | arigato: you have an "XXX find reference" in your post :-) | 19:20 |
| fijal | Alex_Gaynor: feel like implementing the same_as optimization? | 19:21 |
| Action: fijal tried to read iqt | 19:21 | |
| fijal | it | 19:21 |
| arigato | antocuni: I know, but I didn't find it so far :-) | 19:21 |
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| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: in a bit, pycon meeting now | 19:45 |
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| kenaan | 12hager ppc-jit-backend 11425b44c65d66 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/ppcgen/ppc_assembler.py: use force index field as scratch field | 19:52 |
| durin42 | pypy just sped up a utility script doing lots of computation from 25s to 9s :) | 19:53 |
| Alex_Gaynor | yay :) | 19:55 |
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| durin42 | oh, and 1.5 -> 1.7 shaved another 2 seconds off | 19:56 |
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| arigato | :-) | 20:19 |
| CIA-13 | 03agaynor 07roundup * 10#859/numpy script has corrupted memory with JIT: [resolved] Fixed in 741dd1c718ca. * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue859 | 20:22 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: I have read your quantum mechanics paper two times now. | 20:24 |
| stakkars_ | no problem with the math, but I have problems to see the essence of what you claim. | 20:25 |
| stakkars_ | is your claim that the reduction should be done exactly this way? | 20:26 |
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| stakkars_ | I think to read it again a fees times to get the idea. A bit like relativity, where the math was known long before, but the interpretation was not obvious. | 20:29 |
| fijal | arigato: we found a missing (silly optimization) | 20:30 |
| fijal | which is | 20:30 |
| fijal | p = new() | 20:30 |
| fijal | p2 = same_as(p) | 20:31 |
| fijal | jump(p, p2) | 20:31 |
| Alex_Gaynor | fijal: how do you even get same_as though? | 20:31 |
| fijal | no idea | 20:31 |
| stakkars_ | developers: How do I debug test_cpyext.py ? | 20:37 |
| stakkars_ | do I need to use the switch between interp- and app level for this, and how to I get there, nowadays? | 20:39 |
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| stakkars_ | Heeeelp! | 20:41 |
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| arigato | fijal: unsure how you want to do better | 20:45 |
| arigato | it's possible but rather involved | 20:45 |
| arigato | in any case it's not at all a missing silly optimization | 20:46 |
| Alex_Gaynor | arigato: yes it is, if you don't have a same_as the obj is virtualized across loop boundaries | 20:46 |
| arigato | I doubt it, or did hakan implement it? | 20:46 |
| arigato | the issue is not same_as, the issue is that it's passed twice | 20:47 |
| Alex_Gaynor | uhh, could be, although I saw a commit about hte aliasing today | 20:47 |
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| stakkars_ | arigato: I'm again missing something. Trying to debug test_cpyext.py, put I cannot get at it. I cannot set any breakpoint at the various setup_class calls. How do you debug this? | 20:53 |
| stakkars_ | s/put/but/ | 20:53 |
| arigato | stakkars_: I'd recommend to regard cpyext as future work | 20:56 |
| arigato | at least until you can get a working pypy-c | 20:57 |
| arigato | you should also start with a pypy-c with --no-allworkingmodules | 20:57 |
| stakkars_ | sorry, no, I am just missing include files and want to fix this. There are lots of tests which break in the setup() phase. This is a real blocker. I don't want to fix cpyext, I just want failures, not errors. | 20:58 |
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| arigato | then just skip all tests of cpyext for now, | 20:59 |
| stakkars_ | yes, just doing the setup? | 20:59 |
| arigato | e.g. by adding 'import py; py.test.skip("later")' as a first line of the file | 21:00 |
| stakkars_ | aha! ?! | 21:00 |
| Alex_Gaynor | arigato: Does http://paste.pocoo.org/show/515096/ look ok to you? | 21:00 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: thank you! | 21:00 |
| stakkars_ | I'm really suffering tests which don't appear as tests, but as setup errors. That should me help to fix certain basics. | 21:01 |
| stakkars_ | actually, this comes from the introduction of 'Signed" in the C source. I need to find out which include file is missing where and when ;-) | 21:02 |
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| stakkars_ | arigato: no, that evicts too much. I need to get at the point where C functions are compiled, and check their ECI's etc. | 21:07 |
| stakkars_ | well, I'll find out ... | 21:07 |
| stakkars_ | actually wondering how you debugged this all! | 21:09 |
| stakkars_ | And again the question: how do I set a breakpoint in AppLevel? Please don's say "too early", I must know that! | 21:10 |
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| kenaan | 12alex_gaynor default 1106acac97ffa5 15/pypy/jit/codewriter/support.py: simplify this code a bit. | 21:16 |
| stakkars_ | arigato: sorry for bugging you gain. But I want to find out why I get no errors in win32 and missing stuff in win64, regardless of what test I'm running. I do adhere to your recommendations, but I cannot work with "do your groundwork and don't ask". Does not work, I will bail out then. | 21:17 |
| stakkars_ | s/gain/again/ | 21:17 |
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| Action: stakkars_ getting grumpy | 21:22 | |
| arigato | sorry, not really there | 21:24 |
| arigato | you can't easily set a breakpoint at applevel | 21:25 |
| arigato | try to put it at interp-level at the start of some function that is invoked at the critical point | 21:25 |
| arigato | I also think that it's a bit too early to even try to run all tests | 21:26 |
| arigato | you get just large amount of failures | 21:26 |
| stakkars_ | ok. Sorry about my wording. You know me :-) | 21:27 |
| arigato | how about instead to focus on specific tests and ignoring the others | 21:27 |
| stakkars_ | I'm trying to reduce that, already modifying test runner. | 21:27 |
| arigato | I'm not sure I see the point of modifying the test runner | 21:28 |
| stakkars_ | even that does not help. There are some deeper things that prevent compilation. | 21:28 |
| stakkars_ | well, already did, to stop after the first setup failure, for instance. | 21:28 |
| arigato | yes | 21:29 |
| arigato | our buildbot approach was developed after we already had all tests up and running | 21:29 |
| arigato | so it's not really adapted to run tests when a large number of them fail | 21:29 |
| stakkars_ | I am kind of coming too late with this ;-) | 21:29 |
| arigato | no, not really | 21:30 |
| arigato | I'm just saying that buildbot is not the correct tool to use right now | 21:30 |
| arigato | (in my opinion at least) | 21:30 |
| stakkars_ | and I was desperate, because I wanted to look at the C source in BB, but it is all gone after a few other tests. | 21:30 |
| arigato | yes | 21:30 |
| stakkars_ | So I'm doing a few local refinements. | 21:31 |
| arigato | I think it really makes no sense to hack a lot to preserve these sources | 21:31 |
| arigato | even in normal usage, whenever we see a failure on buildbot, the #1 thing to do is try to reproduce it locally | 21:31 |
| stakkars_ | I want to find where exactly I need to add an include file, then it is over. | 21:32 |
| stakkars_ | yes, and locally it worked, which drives me nuts. | 21:32 |
| arigato | then you need to work harder to understand why it works locally | 21:32 |
| arigato | maybe it's because you have un-checked-in files? | 21:33 |
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| arigato | or just local changes? | 21:33 |
| arigato | try in a clean checkout | 21:33 |
| stakkars_ | so right now I'm in a quite defensive mode, pulling teeth ;-) | 21:33 |
| stakkars_ | all good, I just have one failure that fails locally. Therefore, debugging test_cpyext :-) | 21:34 |
| stakkars_ | forget it, you can't stop me. But it helped, really. | 21:34 |
| arigato | if you really want to look at files left behind by the buildbot run, the issue is that /tmp/usession-<number> only remembers the last 4 runs; | 21:34 |
| arigato | but you can hack this number 4 if really you have no other way | 21:35 |
| arigato | pypy/tool/udir.py:27 | 21:35 |
| arigato | sorry, it's 3 by default, not 4 | 21:35 |
| stakkars_ | thanks a lot. Yeah, just found that spot, too. | 21:35 |
| stakkars_ | what are numbers, after all? | 21:36 |
| stakkars_ | ok, let me carry on, I'm getting the problem by its balls, right now | 21:37 |
| stakkars_ | all good. (grumpy, but not at you) | 21:37 |
| arigato | :-) | 21:37 |
| stakkars_ | feeling a bit like WALL-E | 21:40 |
| stakkars_ | bye, eve | 21:41 |
| stakkars_ | Waaaah, all good, got a grip at it!!!!!! | 21:42 |
| stakkars_ | tracing windows.py upside down revealed the error. | 21:45 |
| stakkars_ | I really should a reverse-tracing tool. | 21:45 |
| stakkars_ | s//write/ | 21:45 |
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| stakkars_ | it is the single, not-yet-handled case of compilation _without_ a make file, but producing a stand-alone exe. | 21:49 |
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| arigato | I don't know if that was your intention, but now you triggered me into thinking about "undodb-gdb" | 21:59 |
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| arigato | I wonder what would be required to have a pure Python "undodb-pdb" | 22:00 |
| arigato | more portable than undodb-gdb | 22:00 |
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| stakkars_ | arigato: you are thinking of "how to find out where things come from"? I'm doing that since many days. | 22:07 |
| stakkars_ | and what approach to take, without making it unbearably slow. | 22:07 |
| arigato | undo-software.com | 22:07 |
| stakkars_ | I'm thinking of a way that when a breakpoint is entered, analyzes whatever is on the stack, and triggers breakpoints which as precisely as possible try to capture a point before that happened. | 22:09 |
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| stakkars_ | that is much more efficient that breaking before-hand, when we don't know what we are looking for. | 22:10 |
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| stakkars_ | are they successful? | 22:13 |
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| stakkars_ | I suffered so much in Psyco that I would really work on a general solution | 22:13 |
| stakkars_ | ha! debugging the error handler of compilation enabled tracing into the setup_class :-) :-) | 22:16 |
| arigato | yes, undodb is seriously fast, but it doesn't always work, in the sense that it can crash or hang | 22:16 |
| arigato | at least when trying it on pypy | 22:16 |
| arigato | also I never managed to get the 64-bit version of it running any code | 22:16 |
| stakkars_ | do you have insight into how it works? | 22:17 |
| arigato | only what I read on the web site, but yes | 22:18 |
| Action: stakkars_ going to tame that bastard, soon :-) | 22:18 | |
| arigato | it does regularly fork() the process, which let it keep in a copy-on-write old states | 22:18 |
| stakkars_ | ok, the old heavy way. | 22:18 |
| arigato | that's the basic idea, but then it's likely to be a huge pile of hacks e.g. to record all system calls and what they did | 22:19 |
| arigato | in theory if you only record system calls, then you can replay everything from the start | 22:20 |
| arigato | (in practice there is for example the assembler instruction that gives you a timestamp --- no clue how they handle that) | 22:20 |
| arigato | doing forks is just an optimization of this basic idea | 22:21 |
| arigato | (although, I'm sure, an essential one) | 22:21 |
| stakkars_ | could actually be doing that pretty easily, albeit with a huge overheads, by a controller VM, where you can stop after any # of instructions. | 22:21 |
| stakkars_ | controlled | 22:21 |
| stakkars_ | would be incredibly easy, and veeeeery slow ;-) | 22:22 |
| arigato | note that what I'm describing has basically no cost, apart from fully logging the system calls | 22:22 |
| arigato | that's how they manage to have good performance | 22:22 |
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| stakkars_ | but think of it. I'm working with VMs all day. You could re-run any snapshot | 22:24 |
| stakkars_ | which is, of couse, very much. Hacking PyPy to record just the state needed would make a difference... | 22:25 |
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| stakkars_ | and if they don't use system calls in a very long run? | 22:26 |
| arigato | that's why fork() is a useful optimization | 22:27 |
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| arigato | hum, you could hack pypy in the following way | 22:29 |
| arigato | in normal run mode, all setfields and setarrayitems trigger a write barrier that records the operation | 22:30 |
| arigato | then it should be possible to integrate the result with RPython operations, exposed to app-level e.g. in the __pypy__ module | 22:30 |
| arigato | e.g. capture_state(), returning a State object | 22:31 |
| arigato | which has a method "goback()" | 22:31 |
| arigato | from there you get build e.g. a sys.settrace() that captures the state every line | 22:33 |
| arigato | so that it can be integrated with pdb to step backward | 22:33 |
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| Action: arigato wonders if it's possible to do it in an otherwise-unmodified pypy | 22:34 | |
| arigato | by abusing the existing write barrier | 22:35 |
| stakkars_ | would be a killer-feature for WING-Ide | 22:37 |
| arigato | capture_state() would return a State object that represents the state at this point of time, but which is internally built lazily | 22:37 |
| arigato | when capture_state() is called, it sets a flag in the GC header of *all* objects | 22:37 |
| arigato | this flag causes the write barrier to trigger | 22:37 |
| arigato | and in the write barrier we record the old state of the object into the State object | 22:37 |
| arigato | sounds doable :-) | 22:37 |
| stakkars_ | well, if I didn't find the culprit meanwhile, I might go for it. | 22:38 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-macosx-x86-32/builds/730 | 22:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64/builds/155 | 22:39 |
| bbot2 | Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-32/builds/960 | 22:39 |
| stakkars_ | but essentially, it would help PyPy a lot, wouldn't it? | 22:39 |
| arigato | it still looks like several weeks of hacking | 22:39 |
| arigato | more to do a nice integration into pdb, but I'm sure antocuni would be willing to help there :-) | 22:40 |
| stakkars_ | instead of man-years wasted in trying tricks to catch errors? | 22:40 |
| arigato | yes | 22:40 |
| stakkars_ | is Anto the PDB guru? | 22:40 |
| arigato | yes, he wrote pdb++ | 22:40 |
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| stakkars_ | ah!!! | 22:40 |
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| arigato | the overall benefit for Python programs is definitely non-trivial | 22:41 |
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| arigato | for Python *programmers* | 22:41 |
| arigato | but it's still work | 22:41 |
| arigato | well, I'll sleep on it first | 22:41 |
| stakkars_ | we should ask for support for THAT, claiming that we will otherwise not continue at all! ?? | 22:41 |
| stakkars_ | sleep well | 22:41 |
| arigato | thank you | 22:42 |
| stakkars_ | it would be a real contribution if people help us by supporting this | 22:42 |
| arigato | don't spend the whole rest of the night on your issue :-) | 22:42 |
| stakkars_ | no, got it already ;-) | 22:43 |
| stakkars_ | g'night | 22:43 |
| arigato | :-) | 22:43 |
| arigato | bye | 22:43 |
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| stakkars_ | thank you, bye | 22:43 |
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