#pypy IRC log for Sunday, 2011-12-25

mikefceasy question: what's the best/easiest/most compatible way of linking into C libraries?   I want to call into libjpeg ....00:05
Alex_Gaynorctypes00:06
mikefcalex: is there anything special I need to do with ctypes in pypy?  Or can i just follow a cpython ctypes tute?00:07
Alex_GaynorNope, nothing special00:07
mikefcta00:07
Action: mikefc tries to get some coding progress during the christmas break00:08
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-macosx-x86-32/builds/75500:31
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64/builds/18300:59
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64-2/builds/1101:00
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bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/189901:30
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Alex_Gaynorfijal: Hotspot is scary http://hg.openjdk.java.net/hsx/hotspot-main/hotspot/rev/8c57262447d3 is the code for (as far as I can tell) the virtuals ptr_eq optimizaition we do02:34
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-32/builds/99202:41
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/189903:43
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/148904:51
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-Ojit-no-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/83804:51
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/117105:05
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-64/builds/65505:09
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/64905:13
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: maybe it does something else as well?08:51
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fijalmattip: what is the purpose of matrixmath-dot these days?09:13
kenaan12hakanardo jit-label-counters 1152c88d381e03 15/pypy/: save a bit of memory09:15
kenaan12hakanardo jit-label-counters 11e0d2025b0064 15/pypy/: hg merge default09:15
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/1490 [12hakanardo, jit-label-counters]09:16
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1900 [12hakanardo, jit-label-counters]09:16
fijalhakanardo: hi09:18
hakanardomorning09:18
fijalthx09:19
hakanardoparse_log_counts still needs to be fixed09:20
hakanardoand I'm not sure what we want split_trace to return...09:21
hakanardowould it be better if it cloned trace and then just replaced the operations?09:22
hakanardo(we could then kill the new Part class again)09:22
fijalreplaced with what?09:23
hakanardoclone_of_trace.operations = trace.operations[start : stop + 1]09:23
fijalyeah, that would be pretty good09:23
fijalthat way you can mostly not modify jitviewer09:23
hakanardowe could then even have import_log return sum([split_trace(l) for l in loops]) instead of loops09:25
hakanardoor is it used elsewhere?09:25
kenaan12hakanardo jit-label-counters 11093150a1f76e 15/pypy/tool/jitlogparser/parser.py: use copies of the original trace instead of Part objects09:32
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hakanardofijal: how was logtest.log and logtest2.log generated?09:44
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mattipfijal: I still hold out naive hopes that I can make matrixmath-dot do a matrix multiplication.09:49
mattipbut in order to get there I needed an improved axisiterator09:49
mattipthat would trivially enable reduce functions (sum, prod) to operate on an axis09:50
mattipso I decided to attack that first.09:50
mattipthus numpy-axisop branch was born09:50
fijalhakanardo: PYPYLOG=jit-log-opt,jit-backend:log09:52
fijalok09:52
fijalcool09:52
hakanardofijal: using which script?09:53
fijalmattip: why did you change the existing axisiterator?09:53
fijalit does something else09:53
fijalplease create a new one09:53
fijalyou also broke stuff that way09:53
fijalmattip: it's not 100% clear to me if the AxisIterator as it is will stay, but if it'09:54
fijalll stay, it should be the way it was09:54
mattipIt seemed to me to be a natural extension. I added test_iters.py to make sure I didn't break any existing functionality. I will duplicate it into a different iterator.09:56
fijalfeel free to rename AxisIterator to something else09:56
fijalwell ok, but did you change it's usage then?09:56
mattipNo.09:56
fijalwell09:56
fijaldoes it work?09:56
mattipIt passes all tests, including new ones I wrote.09:57
fijalok09:57
fijalthis was used for the copy09:57
fijalso is probably fine09:57
fijalindeed09:57
mattipbtw, in the copy, why didn't you do the whole memcpy in one fell swoop? You already asserted that the shapes and strides were the same?09:58
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fijalyou don't quite know09:58
fijalsay a[:,1:10] = b[:,1:10]09:58
fijalhas shapes and strides the same, but is not contiguous09:59
fijal'I'm glad my silly idea can be expanded :)09:59
fijalmy initial reaction was "don't touch it it's a hack!"09:59
fijal:]09:59
mattipok, I did write a "is-contiguous" test on a branch once, it seems the common use case is for contiguous arrays.10:00
mattipSo can I continue to use the AxisIterator, it seems to be exactly what I need?10:01
bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/1490 [12hakanardo, jit-label-counters]10:01
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fijalmattip: yes, of course10:06
fijalhakanardo: good10:06
hakanardo:)10:06
fijalcan I merge it if it works?10:07
fijaluh10:10
fijalwhy is that a nojit build?10:10
fijalgrumble10:11
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/650 [12fijal, jit-label-counters]10:11
hakanardohmm I though I started a jit build aswell10:12
fijalwhy do we even have a nojit build?10:12
hakanardoI dont know10:14
hakanardothe intention was to start own and jit10:14
hakanardofijal: feel free to merge if it works10:15
hakanardo(parse_log_counts still needs fixing)10:15
fijalok10:17
fijalI would rather have -Oexperimental than -Ojit-no-jit10:18
fijalhakanardo: how's your image processing working btw?10:19
fijalare you guys using pypy so far?10:20
hakanardonot to any large extent no10:21
hakanardoit's still a bit like you have to known a lot of pypy internals to be able to write a realy fast loop10:21
hakanardoand then a very small change to such an loop may make everyting blow up and become too slow to be usefull...10:22
fijalyes10:22
fijalwe're trying to improve the situation, but indeed10:22
hakanardoI know, we'r getting there :)10:23
fijalbut also to some extent it'll stay that way'10:25
fijalas in - complex operations are too easy in python10:25
fijalhave you seen the link on the mailing list btw?10:26
hakanardowhat link?10:27
fijalhttp://cgi.di.uoa.gr/~sioutis/files/PyRCC8.pdf10:27
hakanardowhat we need is to get to the point where you can explain to someone how to write fast code in pypy without going into details about how the jit is implemented10:28
fijaldepends a bit what "fast" means10:28
hakanardoor atleast not into too hary details :)10:28
hakanardoyes, ofcoure10:28
fijalbesides I'm fine with spending my time explaining to them how the JIT works for money :)10:28
fijalwell10:29
fijalas of now for a reasonably large project *we* have no clue what went wrong10:29
hakanardothat's an issue too, indeed10:31
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/1900 [12hakanardo, jit-label-counters]11:03
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rb2khey there! I'm just trying to switch a few python apps (sabnzbd, &) that are running on my NAS over to pypy11:06
rb2kit's an arch linux system11:06
rb2kx86_6411:06
rb2kmy current problem is that arch already installed all dependencies (e.g. Cheeta) for python 2.711:07
rb2khow would I get pypy to install these too? do I have to pass a special path to PIP?11:07
mikefcrb2k: have a look at virtualenv perhaps?11:07
mikefcotherwise you'll have to delve into arch and figure out how to have pypy be a replacemnt for python2.711:08
Action: mikefc is only a pypy newbie. don't take my word as gospel. they are just the two things I'd look at first.11:09
rb2kthanks!11:10
rb2kI've seen virtualenv  too so this might be a good first try11:10
fijalmikefc: hi11:18
mikefcfijal: morning/afternoon.11:18
fijalmikefc: numpy expr is nonsense in case of pypy11:18
fijalrb2k: yes, virtualenv is your best bet11:18
mikefcfijal: is this in relation to pytables? yeah, the JIT of numpy code in numpyexpr is not needed in pypy's case.11:19
mikefcbut i think it'd take some hacking on pytables to remove it.11:19
fijalmaybe11:19
mikefcwhoever it was that was trying to run it.11:19
fijalisn't pytables essentially a C extension?11:19
rb2khmm, virtualenv errors out saying it doesn't have permission to ?spawn a process?11:19
rb2kwhich is kinda weird11:19
rb2kI think I'll try http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5885820/installing-python-eggs-under-pypy11:19
rb2kseems legit :)11:19
mikefcfijal: I haven't delved into pytables but it seemed like a relatively thin python wrapper around "something" to get data in and out of numpy fast.11:20
mikefcthere seems an awful lot of "python" code out there which is a thin wrapper around a bunch of C11:21
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rb2khmmm, almost everything worked11:30
rb2kbesides trying to install yenc on pypy :(11:30
rb2kthis is the log: https://gist.github.com/ac0b4ae4ce7f8bcbc49a11:30
rb2ksrc/_yenc.c:202:6: error: PyFile_Type undeclared (first use in this function)11:30
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fijalgrrrr11:33
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fijal<fijal> mikefc: besides numexpr does not jit11:33
fijal<fijal> as in it does not generate asm11:33
fijal<fijal> and has ugly interface11:33
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mikefcfijal: never used it :)11:34
fijalok11:34
mikefcfijal: rb2k is having a problem with yenc.  he posted his failure on https://gist.github.com/ac0b4ae4ce7f8bcbc49a11:34
mikefcsrc/_yenc.c:202:6: error: PyFile_Type undeclared (first use in this function)11:34
fijalwell11:34
mikefcrb2k: you may need to file a bug report.11:35
fijalthis is a C extension isn't it?11:35
mikefcor fijal may weigh in.11:35
Action: mikefc has no idea what it is.11:35
fijalthe PyFile_* is not supported right now11:35
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Action: mikefc is still trying to find the time to figure out ctypes.11:35
rb2kahhh, ok11:36
rb2kthat solves that problem :)11:36
rb2kI guess I'll wait for a bit before trying11:36
fijalrb2k: yuo'll wait for what?11:37
rb2kPyFile_* to be supported11:37
mikefcrb2k: there must be a python yenc out there.11:37
rb2kit's mainly for getting a few python tools (sick beard, couch potato, sabnzbd) up and running11:38
fijalrb2k: you might want to change your dependencies11:38
rb2kno personal development :)11:38
fijalI doubt anyone would write PyFile_* support any time soon11:38
rb2kI just thought they could use the speed boost since they're running on a somewhat CPU limited system11:38
fijalrb2k: this is a very good example how not to write python libraries11:38
rb2k:)11:38
fijalit's a bit pointless to do that sort of thing in C11:38
fijal(on pypy at least)11:38
fijaland increases complexity a lot11:39
fijalso I would rather say "yenc should provide a pure-python equivalents"11:39
mikefcshould a yenc function be about 10 lines long?11:39
mikefcahhh "lack of formal standardization"11:40
mikefcthat'll slow you down 11:40
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/650 [12fijal, jit-label-counters]12:05
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CIA-5303mikefc 07roundup * 10#972/inconsistence with cpython (datetime?): 13:02
CIA-53[chatting] Is this just a rounding error depending upon math implementations?13:02
CIA-53I'm running on OSX13:02
CIA-53============================= running a nig ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue97213:02
fijal... ger?13:04
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fijalstakkars_: hi13:07
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kenaan12fijal jit-label-counters 118273e78218c5 15/: close merged branch13:10
kenaan12fijal default 114c2a8587e2c5 15/pypy/: Merge jit-label-counters, an attempt to fix jitviewer13:10
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fijalhakanardo: ping13:14
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fijalhttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/525717/13:15
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stakkarsfijal: hi13:19
fijalmerry christmas christian13:19
stakkarsmerry christmas to you, too13:20
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fijalmikefc: pytables is quite a bit of C code14:22
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aleksiHello. I'm writing a hash function, which relies heavily on int32 arithmetics with overflows. For first version I implemented my own uint32 class, but Python between me and C-level int32 looks weird. Is it possible to write it in RPython?15:00
fijalaleksi: do you really want to do that?15:01
fijalwrite stuff in RPython>?15:01
fijalyou can use numpy.uint32 I believe15:01
fijalarigato: hi15:01
aleksiWell, I'm interested to try. :)15:01
fijalyou should not use RPython for such stuff15:01
aleksiI already wrote it in C for CPython, so I'm not so scarred. :)15:02
fijalarigato: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/525717/15:02
fijalaleksi: why don't you use numpy.uint32?15:03
Rhyolitehi15:03
fijalRhyolite: hi15:03
Rhyolitealeksi: It is not about scared.  It is about using the right tool for the right problem.15:03
fijalRhyolite: I can give you some replies to your arguments yesterday, but maybe we should move off the channel15:03
aleksifijal: For no particular reason. In fact I never used it. :)15:03
arigatofijal: /me passes the "blame" to hakanardo15:03
Rhyolitefijal: :-)15:03
fijalarigato: do you feel like helping with debugging?15:04
fijalarigato: or not really? ;-)15:04
fijalarigato: all I'm trying to do is to fix the jitviewer :/15:04
arigatoI can, yes15:04
arigatosure :-/15:04
fijalwe got most of the job done15:04
fijalor hakan did15:04
fijalarigato: I have a screen on tannit15:04
fijaltrying to reproduce it, but it's somewhere inside setuptools or os15:05
fijalarigato: btw, http://baroquesoftware.com/~fijal/15:05
arigato:-)15:06
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kenaan12fijal default 1105c2089f5545 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/unroll.py: (fijal, arigo) A partial revert of 1e4c74e007f4, reintroduce emitting of same_as if some optimizations did not prod...15:36
fijalarigato: ^^^15:38
fijalI kick translation again15:38
fijaland see if I can work on jitviewer :/15:38
arigatoslow process :-/15:39
fijalyes well15:39
fijalit should "just work" now (tm)15:39
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arigatogood :-)15:39
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fijalarigato: so my idea is to have a thing called "JitPortal" which would have a bunch of functions called on it15:39
fijaland could be provided by the interpreter15:40
fijalso for example would have a function like notify_abort15:40
fijalwhich would be called on each JIT abort15:40
arigatoall at app-level?15:40
fijalso far it's interp-level15:40
fijalbut then they can call stuff on app-level15:40
arigatolooks good, but we should check also if it makes sense in a multi-portal world15:41
arigatoah15:41
fijalso, portal would be one15:41
arigatoonly one, good15:41
fijalbut it would call with jit driver or jit driver number15:41
fijalso for example on_compile would work15:41
fijala bit of wrangling15:42
fijalbut it should work at the end15:42
arigatoyes, makes sense15:42
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Action: arigato away15:49
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tumbleweedI take it TinyObjSpace is a lightweight objspace for testing, but it doesn't have a config attribute http://paste.pocoo.org/show/525757/ Should I not be looking at space.config?15:57
fijaltinyobjspace is only for -A tests15:59
tumbleweedyeah, I figured that much out16:00
fijalit depends how much you care about those tests running on -A16:00
Action: tumbleweed doesn't know how important that is16:00
fijalwhat test is it?16:01
fijalI need the entire TB16:02
tumbleweedhttp://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=users/stefanor/pypy.git;a=blob;f=debian/patches/pep3147-core16:02
fijaltraceback16:02
tumbleweedfull traceback is in http://people.debian.org/~stefanor/pypy/pypy_1.7+dfsg-1_amd64.build16:03
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fijaltumbleweed: you should do something like get_pyc_magic does16:06
tumbleweedah, yes16:08
tumbleweedI'd totally ignored that16:08
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tumbleweedI don't know if I should even bother making it configurabel, but if it made sense for the so extension...16:14
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kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 11be708e46d261 15/pypy/jit/: make the test pass, by calling the abort function16:17
kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 1139462e5a78fc 15/: merge default16:18
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kenaan12arigo default 11cdc91cd4ab61 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/unroll.py: Tentative fix.16:24
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kenaan12fijal default 116dc65dbb9258 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/unroll.py: since we don't track aliases any more, no point in calling it.16:26
kenaan12fijal default 1144b0e2106e2d 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/unroll.py: merge16:26
fijalarigato: ^^^ no changes16:26
arigato:-)16:27
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fijalarigato: do we need -O2 and -Ojit-nojit nightly?16:54
fijalcan't we replace one with "experimental features"?16:54
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arigatothey are occasionally useful16:56
arigatobut very occasionally16:56
fijalboth at the same time?16:57
fijalI would rather have one with -Oexperimental16:57
fijalthat has say stringjoin optimization16:57
fijaland some other stuff16:57
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arigatoyes, both, but both very occasionally17:00
arigato-Ojit-nojit is useful to know if a crash is really due to pypy/jit/* or not17:00
fijalwe have --jit off these days17:00
fijalwhich we use17:00
arigatohum, right17:00
fijalI haven't used -Ojit-nojit in a long time17:00
arigatook, so -Ojit-nojit is useless now :-)17:01
fijal-O2 is primarily useful because of minimark vs hybrid17:01
fijalcan we introduce -Oexperimental then?17:01
arigatohybrid is in -Ojit-nojit right now17:01
arigatofwiw17:01
fijalok17:02
fijalso anyway, I claim one of the two can go away17:02
arigatoyes, absolutely17:02
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kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 1179a44aea441d 15/pypy/: support from the pypyjit module side17:14
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fijalarigato: ever seen http://paste.pocoo.org/show/525782/17:19
fijal?17:19
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arigatofijal: no17:26
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fijalArach: ?17:44
fijaler17:44
fijalarigato: :(17:44
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fijalyaks on top of yaks17:44
arigatotry running "test_ztranslation -k test_stuff", in parallel if needs be17:45
fijalok17:46
fijalwell17:46
fijalI'm unable to debug jitviewer17:46
fijalor get it to run17:46
fijalbecause  of what it seems are irrelevant bugs17:47
kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 11114e4166cfd6 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/pyjitpl.py: oops17:47
fijaluh17:49
fijalI removed it?17:49
kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 118ac7b4de9412 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/jitprof.py: put it back17:50
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kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 11979a63998eaa 15/pypy/jit/metainterp/optimizeopt/unroll.py: another merge default17:55
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fijalwtf19:06
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fijalsomeone broke imports?19:06
fijalarigato: ehem19:07
fijalping?19:07
arigatopong?19:07
fijalwhat's lib_pypy/collections.py?19:07
fijal???19:07
fijalshould not that be _collections.py?19:07
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kenaan12arigo concurrent-marksweep 11b0bb363299dd 15/pypy/rpython/memory/gc/concurrentgen.txt: Add a textual introduction.  Needs to think out more precisely what it implies for the rest of the doc...19:08
Action: arigato doesn't find lib_pypy/collections.py19:08
fijalindeed19:09
arigatosome old file left over by "hg update"?19:09
fijalARGH19:09
fijalARGH ARGH ARGH19:09
fijalhg is a piece of crap :/19:09
arigato"hg status" should show it, at least19:10
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fijalhg up some-old-branch-noone-cares-about and Ctrl-C19:10
fijalleaves you in a state that's irreperable :/19:10
timotimowhat.19:10
MostAwesomeDudeAh, hg.19:10
fijaltimotimo: you have old files all over the place19:10
timotimodid you have changes in your working dir whne you up'd?19:11
arigatohg purge19:11
fijalarigato: that deletes the entire compiled/ directory for example19:12
arigatoheh19:13
Action: arigato tries to find out why it doesn't for him19:13
arigatoah, I've added "compiled" to my ignored files19:13
fijalok19:14
fijalis it globally added?19:14
arigatohttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/525826/19:14
fijalthx19:17
fijalheh19:21
fijalthe hooks are a bit useless if I can't tell the greenkey :)19:21
fijalarigato: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/525828/19:26
fijalthis is an example where we call TRACE_TOO_LONG19:26
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fijalthis is probably not that interesting even19:26
fijalbut we do it almost per test19:27
fijalor per one-two tests19:28
fijalI think it's call_function from start trace19:28
fijalbut it's just that the endless inlining does not quite fly19:29
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fijalhakanardo: ah well, now they're not really indexable19:58
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fijalbut fine19:58
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Action: arigato is vaguely impressed by test_optimizeopt.py's length: 7765 lines20:01
fijalarigato: when "bad loop" happens?20:01
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arigatofijal: no idea20:01
fijalwhen I pass --inline=020:02
fijalI make a record for running pypy py.test test/test_numarray.py20:02
fijalit's 40s20:02
fijalnormally it hovers around 7020:02
fijalcpython is 2720:03
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fijalbut I do get quite a few BAD_LOOP20:05
fijalaborts20:05
fijalarigato: why does locals()[k] escapes virtualizable???20:07
fijalah, only when inlining is off?20:08
fijalarigato: this is how our tracing looks like20:10
fijalhttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/525839/20:10
fijal'.' is a passing test20:10
fijaleach ABORT is one aborted tracing20:10
fijalnice isn't it?20:10
fijal/home/fijal/src/pypy/lib_pypy/_ctypes/structure.py aborts tracing btw20:11
fijalon line 7720:11
kenaan12fijal better-jit-hooks 117abc703337f7 15/lib_pypy/_ctypes/structure.py: speed up _ctypes quite a bit by not forcing virtualizable. Good question *why* it did force virtualizable ...20:15
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fijalarigato: seems "mail hakan"20:32
fijalcontains # XXX for now20:32
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